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Messages - Deathlike2

1996
Gaming Discussion / Re: Fun FF3/6 Question
« on: August 20, 2008, 01:00:30 PM »
Gogo (No love for Gogo :sad:)

I'm never understood how people misunderstand Gogo.  Gogo's the one-person insta-make the party better character.
...Um? I never said I didn't like Gogo... It was meant as a joke (Saved for last = no love). I actually like Gogo a lot--Back in my NMG days, Gogo, along with Terra and Celes, would always be on my team, basically making Gogo the Magic God. I'm sure you have some really good points in that post, but I'm afraid your attempts to convince me that Gogo's a good character are for naught, as I already think Gogo's a good character.

Sorry, I didn't see through the sarcasm.  :tongue:

I put Gogo at the top of my list of characters to use. It just bothers me when people think Gogo sucks (most don't try to combine useful commands+characters together).

Cyan is still probably at very the bottom of my list of "characters I don't care about"...

1997
Gaming Discussion / Re: Fun FF3/6 Question
« on: August 20, 2008, 12:16:12 PM »
Gogo (No love for Gogo :sad:)

I'm never understood how people misunderstand Gogo.  Gogo's the one-person insta-make the party better character.

Let me bring out the negatives just so we get it out of the way.

1) He's a poor facsimile to many characters, primarily because Gogo can't use Espeers for stat growth.
2) The armor options just outright suck. For some reason, the FF6A devs overlooked giving Gogo a new piece of armor (seriously, Gogo needs it IMO). Tao Robe is probably the best solution and that's still pretty bad...
Note: If I forgot any other reasons, please let me know.

Ok, so those are the primary complaints, and I understand that.. yet, Gogo provides the following:
1) Insta-magic w/o having Gogo learn a thing. This is a freaking godsend! You will still have to pair Gogo with a character with all the available magic, but that's not a big deal in the grand scheme of things.
2) Attach the most useful commands for any situation. Find a battle, and you can make Gogo a boss wrecking machine, or an auto-win for regular battles. You can save command space since Fight nor Item needs to be used late game.
3) Mimic is the only command that duplicates other existing commands w/o having to equip the freaking thing in the menu! X-Magic, Steal/Capture, Control (this is rather unappreciated by many), Swordtech can be had w/o wasting a command slot. That's hard to complain about. It might not be perfect, but you can work with this in mind, especially when FF3/6 allows you the full control over command input, unlike the previous FF incarnations.
4) Gogo's totally overpowered..

Consider the following commands...
Blitz
Tools
Lore

None of these are exciting, yet they are handy for what they can do. Some people overlook this combo (at least I haven't), to producing the most overpowered anti-boss combo that have ever existed (works great in FF6A).

Blitz - If you can live with Bum Rush and Mantra, you're doing pretty well. Add Sabin and dual Mantra is a healing godsend.
Tools - Autocrossbow for regular battles and Drill for specific enemy targeting cannot be understated. However, people don't use the Debilitator enough in conjunction with..
Lore - There is one late game spell worth getting, and I wished it was available much earlier, but it can have the most use in FF6A. You may have heard of it.. it's called Forcefield. Neutralizing one elemental for everyone isn't sexy nor useful in theory. Combine this with the Debilitator and you can generally destroy any boss with ease. Yes, it is kinda slow to be useful since you have to waste a lot of MP and turns, but if you spend time with the more difficult boss battles in some hacks and FF6A, it's actually worth the time spent to make yourself nearly invincible... elementally anyways.

Then there's also Rage. If you needed a more powerful Gau (at least with physical rages) that doesn't need a Merit Award, Gogo is the perfect solution. This option beats out a lot of existing mindless solutions for making certain common/boss battles easier...

Anyways, Gogo may be 60% to 80% as effective as the original, but if you just level the person up enough (hint: Exp Egg), it's not that much different than the original character (other than characters that naturally equip overpowered swords), plus you can cover most deficiencies that your party has. That's something that no other character can vouch for.

1998
Gaming Discussion / Re: Fun FF3/6 Question
« on: August 20, 2008, 10:58:11 AM »
Eh?

1999
General Discussion & Support / Re: FF3USHT Bug Fixing?
« on: August 20, 2008, 10:49:22 AM »
http://rapidshare.com/files/138770944/FF3Hack3.7z.html - Here's a slightly better version of the same battle, remember how I beat him in the first place.

 :edit:

http://rapidshare.com/files/138799882/FF3Hack3.7z.html - Plague/Doom Gaze needs to be a tad harder than adding another one...

 :edit:

http://rapidshare.com/files/138805663/FF3Hack3.7z.html - DirtDragon looks like more of the same...

2000
Gaming Discussion / Re: Fun FF3/6 Question
« on: August 20, 2008, 09:13:19 AM »
For a thought, but Terra's arguably the 2nd easiest (maybe 3rd) to obtain.. only because you just have to goto a straight boss battle once you get the airship (unless the story wasn't accelerated if a trip to Mobliz wasn't made prior).

Although, I remember one hack that forced me to avoid that trip to Mobliz because the boss used Merton...  :wtf:

I'd like to know the name of that hack. this way, I can smack anyone who thinks it's good.

It is archived at Zophar's... http://www.zophar.net/hacks/snes/final-fantasy-3/final-fantasy-vi-expert-version-2.html

FF6 Expert Hack version 2.

It was great, though I kinda wish I had version 1 for my amusement. The guy's website went down for whatever reason... so I don't know wtf happened to the author.

I don't recall any major bugs.. just a lot of interesting tweaks to say the least.

2001
Gaming Discussion / Re: Fun FF3/6 Question
« on: August 19, 2008, 09:35:50 PM »
For a thought, but Terra's arguably the 2nd easiest (maybe 3rd) to obtain.. only because you just have to goto a straight boss battle once you get the airship (unless the story wasn't accelerated if a trip to Mobliz wasn't made prior).

Although, I remember one hack that forced me to avoid that trip to Mobliz because the boss used Merton...  :wtf:

2002
Doesn't FF5 or FF6 follow something like this, or are they coded differently (eg, the stat checks are done with the command itself)?

2003
Yeah, I was pretty surprised by that, too. Doesn't quite make sense to me, but I'm sure it was intended. I guess poison weakens him so much he can't store the necessary power...?

I'll update the list to reflect auto-fails.

Well, considering how the Monk has progressed in the SNES versions of the game, I'd say it makes sense (FF6's Mantra, FF5's Monk has a self-healing command that removes Poison IIRC). It just bothers me that Poison is exposed once during the whole time Yang is in the party.. you would never know this. Then again, Kick being disabled by float makes sense, but you'd never find this out normally... yet that wouldn't explain Jump at all...

2004
Pray and Gird need to be fixed by adding Mute status to that list (they auto fail because they execute magic).

The Poison status affecting Power/Deadly actually shocks me.. I should've noticed this vs Dr. Lugae. This property surprisingly is still applied to FF4A (unlike Float affecting Kick).

2005
Want to list them? Or did one of my long old thread about them covers all of them already...? I'm still digging for it...

Here we go: http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=468.0

2006
Gaming Discussion / Re: FF3/6 - Understanding Gogo
« on: August 19, 2008, 04:07:30 PM »
Anyways..

http://www.geigercount.net/crypt/index.html
Suddenly JCE's screenshot of the skills menu bleeding into the status menu is making sense. Let's see what this is breaking...

Are you trying to figure out the menu itself? (I've already posted a link to the yellow streak fix, unless that's not what you're looking for...)

2007
Gaming Discussion / Re: FF3/6 - Understanding Gogo
« on: August 19, 2008, 03:19:52 PM »
I made some edits during your post..

Anyways..

http://www.geigercount.net/crypt/index.html

This was a result from an inquiry from this thread: http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=506.0

2008
Gaming Discussion / Re: FF3/6 - Understanding Gogo
« on: August 19, 2008, 03:06:21 PM »
This is true, but I think it has to do moreso with how his list is initiated. Once a character is introduced, their command set is probably added to the list.
The order is Terra, Locke, Edgar, Sabin, (then it's out of order because of the scenarios, since it's between Cyan, Gau, and Celes), Setzer, Shadow (he is forced on you when you leave for Thamasa), Strago, then Relm. Mog, Gogo, and Umaro are never forced on you.

I started to amend my state later in the original post (mind drifting often is not a good sign for me).

Quote
Aside from the commands everybody gets (Magic and Item), the list follows that order. However, some commands are excluded (Morph, Revert, and Leap).

While I was writing that, I was trying to figure out which commands never show up.. (thanks to the guy who made the "Select Any Command" hack)

This includes..
Morph
Revert
Leap
Health
Shock
Row
Def.
Mimic
Magitek

Quote
Now, going back to my thought in my previous post...

Quote
An old FF3USHT completed game:
This list is severely out of order to what it should be.

That's what drew this:

Quote
Ok, I do know that there is something funky going on. Throw is supposed to be the command with Gogo's screwed up portrait. There must be data for this, so where is this data?

To which you made a snarky reply:

Do I have to spell it out?
I fully understood what you said previously.

I'll state my question again. There has to be some data controlling it, since I haven't found any code yet excluding commands or determining the order for it. Where is it?

My reply was I thought you didn't understand how Gogo's command list was derived from. My fault there. AFAIK, there's a fix for the Yellow Streak bug, but I totally forgot who was responsible for that....

Found it... http://www14.brinkster.com/assassin17/patches.htm#anchor21

 :edit:
Rereading your post.. I have no idea where the code that controls his command list comes from.

 :edit:
Ok.. now I understand it better.

Playing around with the hack further... the whole command list is added one by one from each character, including Terra. There's a list of exceptions which aren't included (already listed)... this list also factors in Umaro's command list as well (yes, even for the uncommandable wonder), though I don't know if there are additional commands on other characters are made (Banon, Leo, etc.).

I'm kinda sure they aren't made on the Moogles themselves (JCE game them all the Dance command and that doesn't show up on Gogo's list anyways).

2009
Gaming Discussion / Re: FF3/6 - Understanding Gogo
« on: August 19, 2008, 02:27:38 PM »
Hehe.   :xzone:

Now that I think about it, I liked FF5's X-Zone better...  :tongue:

Anyways, it would be appreciated if the discussion (and some of the posts) should be moved here to keep this thread on topic:
http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=734.0

2010
Gaming Discussion / Re: FF3/6 - Understanding Gogo
« on: August 19, 2008, 02:25:14 PM »
I'm writing this out mainly to remove it from the other thread (since it's there for a different purpose  :tongue:)

Feel free to split and merge threads as appropriate..

Anyways.. this is how Gogo's command screen operates as far as I can tell (I could be totally wrong, and if it's documented elsewhere, then  :bah:)

There has to be some command array that stores all the commands Gogo has available...

Initially, this array has Blank (command removal), Fight, Magic, and Item in it.

Then, it traverses through everyone's command list, from Locke to Gau, skipping Terra. The only reason to skip Terra is to avoid adding Morph to the command list (so Gogo can't use it).
It goes in order..
Locke
Cyan
Shadow (there's probably a bit to check to see if Shadow didn't survive)
Edgar
Sabin
Celes
Strago
Relm
Setzer
Mog
Gau

Commands to be added are checked against the existing command array (to avoid duplication). The only commands that are not added probably includes Leap (and maybe more).

I honestly don't know why Rage doesn't appear in the screenshot.. other than the fact that the list has a visual limit... the reason why I say this is because of Lenophis's old FF3 hack..

Gau's revised command list:


Complete command list:


So, there's a limit as far as I can tell to the command list.... I could be wrong.

Anyways, that all I know. Obviously the commands added to the list do not include those modified by equipment (Capture, Control, X-Magic, GP Rain).