Aslickproductions.org/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=4rpmddblr0qsa28id791kk1410&action=profile;u=6;area=showposts;start=2850e:/My Web Sites/Slick Productions - FFIV Message Board/slickproductions.org/forum/index445a-3.htmlslickproductions.org/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=4rpmddblr0qsa28id791kk1410&action=profile;area=showposts;u=6e:/My Web Sites/Slick Productions - FFIV Message Board/slickproductions.org/forum/index445a-3.html.zxh^0 OKtext/htmlISO-8859-1gzip@Wed, 11 Mar 2020 08:31:50 GMT0 0Ph^5B Show Posts - Deathlike2

Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.


Messages - Deathlike2

2851
Final Fantasy IV Research & Development / Re: Barrier Status...
« on: March 13, 2008, 05:48:29 PM »
I'll take your word for it.. here's the command list for your reference: http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=424.0

I will still get around to testing this. This isn't that overpowered, considering Zeromus, and I think ZeromusEG in FF4A, and the monster that drops the Hero Shield in FF4A casts Black Hole casts it as well, making it irrelevent as a threat.

2852
The Tower of Bab-il documents can be found on Romhacking.net, but here's the direct link:

http://www.romhacking.net/docs/%5B97%5Dff2usdocs.zip

Along with the offsets document from Yousei's FF4Edit, those files started me on my way to understanding the FF4 ROM. I think you'll find them helpful, although maybe not as much as I did since you know more starting off. But there's still some good tables and things in there, like the spell data and spell code explanation, and the enemy data table.

If you look in the spell code explanation document, they actually show the check for Cure4 when single targeting, so you're right on that. That's what makes me think the same goes for other spells.

Ok, I'll check that out.

Quote
As for Sylph, I don't think there is an "enemy attack" classification for spells, other than the 8-letter names vs 6-letter names. I think enemies simply don't take MP cost into account (since they don't even have MP data, right?). If you change an enemy attack to have an MP cost, enemies can still cast it (no matter the cost) but if you add the spell to your list, it will still cost your character MP.

It's not quite that. I mean it is "classified" as an enemy casted magic. Think of Milon (or Scarmilglione), before he becomes undead. He casts Lit-1, but even if you suck out all the MP from him, he can continues to cast it. Think of the Sylph spell in terms of enemy casted magic, and that's why it is operating as such. There is some bit that says "hey, I'm being casted by an enemy" and the game interprets that and makes it cost 0 MP as a result.

I'll post in a new thread my findings if there is anything of significance.

2853
Final Fantasy IV Research & Development / THE Command Thread
« on: March 13, 2008, 05:41:28 PM »
Here's a list of commands and their relavent posts. If there isn't a post, one will probably be created soon.
These commands will be listed in the order you meet the characters:

Defend/Parry - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=317.0

Dark Wave - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=214.0
Jump -  http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=265.0
Recall/Remember - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=304.0
Sing - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=292.0
Hide - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=310.0
Medicine - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=294.0
Pray - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=307.0
Aim - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=306.0
Power/Buildup - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=266.0
Kick - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=215.0
Gird/Endure - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=288.0
Boast - Increases Wisdom (Intellgence) by 16... which I just confirmed. The stat is capped at 99 though...
Cry - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=344.0
Cover - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=309.0
Peep/Scan - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=363.0
Throw/Dart - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=412.0
Sneak/Steal - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=268.0
Spirit Wave - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=308.0

Edit: Reordered the listing a bit to favor the internal data...

2854
Final Fantasy IV Research & Development / Re: Barrier Status...
« on: March 13, 2008, 05:21:20 PM »
Whoops, I'd never tried targeting Jump or Throw on allies, so I didn't know. However, I retested on an enemy: Jump still missed, but Throw did damage. I'll edit my last post.

Jump missed huh? Hmm, that almost never happens unless you are using the Drain/Blood spear...

Throw never misses.

Quote
Also, did some more tests. Yang's Power command misses, but Kick and DarkWave can both still do damage.

Power is simple a 2x hit, like Jump is, but have different animation/behavior/consequences.

Kick+Dark Wave never miss either.

What you should be testing is Aim though...

I'll have to create a new post on currently documented command behaviors... and link you to that.

2855
General Discussion / Re: Paladin...
« on: March 13, 2008, 04:52:20 PM »
Quote
We already have that thread... but it's somewhere deep in a post in the FF4 research forum. Probably a good idea to use the search feature if necessary. One is for the level up data.. the other is for adding magic for those that don't have it.

Found it: http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=169.0...looks like JCE had the level data and Phoenix decoded the menu part of it. Nice work!

There's another thread on improving the palette/graphics for the menus. A hack with that knowledge would look that much more awesome (especially with FF4 looking rather dated in relation to its SNES breathren).

Quote
Quote
You know, it makes me almost think they scripted that final battle intentionally, only because they royally fucked up according to your description.

I think they fucked up a lot of things with the characters. I mean it's AFU with Golbez and Anna.

In the sprite table "Piggy" is Chr#14, Golbez is Chr#15, and Anna is Chr#16. With Golbez and Anna being "half" complete sprites.

The palettes for the sprites are disordered at the end too. Golbez is palette 14, Anna's battle sprite is #15 and it's garbage colors. Another Palette is #16 which is the actual palette for Anna but it is only used in the Kaipo Waterhag battle apparition.

For some stupid reason in the magic lists Golbez comes as Character #16, and Anna is actually #15 (I've tested it to be sure). The developers pointed the Fu spells at character 15 so Golbez doesn't have any. WTF?

The Avatars at the end (after Fu) are #14 "Piggy", #15 "Midget", #15 "Toad". Which seems to make sense for Golbez since if you put him in a party his avatar is "Midget" and it references an all black palette (which is correct for golbez if he had an Avatar). In fact you could probably dummy out the Minimize spell from the game and make Golbez nearly playable, with even an avatar.

I can understand why Golbez has a character, if for no other reason than for the game engine to use him in a battle at the end (intentionally scripted or not), but Anna...why? My only guess is that Anna was originally supposed to be playable in some way? Perhaps there was a whole scenario created and then cut from the Damcyan Invasion sequence, in which Anna was playable or was at least scripted in a battle sequence.

Anyway, it looks like a bunch of development garbage that was left behind or never finished to me. That or when the decided to create the "Piggy" effect for the characters and that's when they used the actual data originally created as a character.

Anna's sprite, as it stands, has action squares and palette that can be used, I've "fixed" them. Well the hack of mine you have should be "fixed" in that manner.

AFAIK, it could be to save space, but I could be totally wrong on that. Anna-Edward really should have a sequence.. given that the dialog hints to that. The Cover command can probably, so that's not the issue. The issue would most likely be trying to show enemies spitting arrows at you.

Quote
It just seems like so much was hacked and rushed with this game...I have also learned something else about FF4DS that is fucked...that IMO was "hacked" in the original and should have been fixed:
[spoiler]The Tower of Zot is again NOT shown. That's bullshit. They should have taken the time to finally show us what it was. I'm told that the consensus among Japanese players is that it is a floating fortress that orbits too high in the sky to be noticed. Hell...FF5 has a floating fortress and FF6 has a floating CONTINENT. You'd think in the DS game they could have taken the time to finally show us Zot. 
:lame:[/spoiler]

That's not new news, but I agree. Although, I'm surprised it wasn't added in the DS game. I suspect it has something to do with the overworld map and flying objects though in the original game...

Quote
Quote
Most of it is my opinion, but if you go by how the FF series (at least the SNES one) calculates attacks against defense and evade, defense has less of an impact until it is closer to the max... evade has a stronger impact in general. Even though magic defense will generally look like it is in the vicinity of suckage, the spells enemies cast on you in generally aren't powerful to begin with. It is all relative to the enemies you fight against. Maybe it's just me that I prefer to trade defense for magic defense/evade (like FF6's choice between the Genji Armor vs Force Armor... I pick the Force Armor over Genji all the time).

I forgot this bit before. But, yes I agree with you on FF6. I learned a long time ago that the Force Equipment does a better job. Edgar is my #1 in that game, and even though the characters get godlike in that game at high levels anyway, I figured out how to turn Edgar (it would work for like Tina, Celes, or anyone else that can naturally use swords and heavy equipment), into a one-man slaughter factory:

Helmet: Something Decent?
Armor: Force Armor
Shield: Paladin Shield
Weapon: Atma Weapon
Relic1: Offering
Relic2: Something Good, like Economizer or Gem Box or Marvel Shoes

With the Force Armor and Paladin Shield he almost can't get hit with any kind of magic attack and physical attacks don't do much. At levels 70 or greater Atma weapon is either so powerful (or just plain ignores) the x/4 penalty of the Offering and can, at high levels, hit 4x for 9999-DMG. Even Ultima + Gem Box is no match for his destructive power. For more fun give him a Genji Glove and another uber sword like Ragnarok, Excalibur, or Scimitar and, well, you get the idea. I hate the stock Illumina though, since it rapes you of your MP to hit harder (and even worse with an Offering). I turn off the MP suckage for it in my hacks on that game.

I prefer not to get into the FF6 talk (not that I don't love it, but that game has been documented to death, and then some). Though, I do recall a bug with MP consuming attacks and putting them in the left hand in a Genji Glove setup... the Illumina failed to critical hit all the time... I'm just trying to debunk how evade is really beneficial to Cid... It's Yang that's much more fragile than Cid is, in relation to magic evade, or lack thereof.

2856
General Discussion / Re: Paladin...
« on: March 13, 2008, 01:54:43 PM »
Quote
I'm slightly pissed at Cid.. that you gave him the Steal command (I have a slight updated finding about that) and you know how useless those Cure1 potions are? Give him the Medicine Command! (I know, it's lame, but for this part of the game, it actually isn't that counterintuitive!.

Ah...they're even more useless when wasting Edge's turns to steal them... :laugh:
Actually I think you've hit on something. How about both Medicine and Steal. That way he can steal a ton of Cure1's and then use them on the entire party  :omg: I kind of like that idea.

That was the idea..  :tongue: That would've been my only suggestion to JCE's hack actually, since he removed that command in favor of Steal, but ironically they ideally work together.

Quote
I've actually played with those some and found that you can use that "unused" magic list. If you give it spells and then map it to a magic command the character will "learn" the spells when they level up. I mapped it Cain and it worked just fine. The only problem I've run into is A) Characters like Cain, Cid, etc... Don't gain MP as they level up (so far I've hacked the Save to make it work) and B)I don't know how to tell the game that a character can use magic, so that you can see the list in the game menu when you pick "Magic" and the character.

We already have that thread... but it's somewhere deep in a post in the FF4 research forum. Probably a good idea to use the search feature if necessary. One is for the level up data.. the other is for adding magic for those that don't have it.

Quote
I also found that the game is trying to Map FuSoYa's magic menu's to the Golbez character record but they got it wrong and mapped them to Anna. Not that it matters, you can't use either character normally anyway. But it explains why the Golbez character has Black and White magic enabled in the menu. Obviously you can fix it and Golbez could then cast magic.

You know, it makes me almost think they scripted that final battle intentionally, only because they royally fucked up according to your description.


Edit:

I do really appreciate the descriptions of the weapons... You've certainly got more knowledge on how they work than I. I read your posts about equipping stuff in the thread about your GameFAQs post. That's really interesting insight into how to best equip your characters, some of it is counter intuitive. Thanks for the Item data updates on some of the bytes/bits too!
Well...when I get some time to update that page I'll incorporate your data into there.

Well, if you have random questions that I occasionally do, feel free to ask. I have thoughts on killing Asura w/o using Reflect/Wall (and I'm pretty sure it won't involve overleveling) and why the Genji set of equipment is near useless to me.

2857
General Discussion / Re: Paladin...
« on: March 13, 2008, 10:32:30 AM »
Yeah...there's some weird stuff in that hack. I don't think I fixed the "Rosa x Cecil" embrace sprite (ya know, after you save her in Zot)...that may be screwed up. I also used Yousei's map editor to do some funky stuff with the world map. When you get the hovercraft you can pretty much access the entire world map using strategically placed shoals, just don't go places you shouldn't early (like talk to the king of Fabul) or the game will eventually screw up. There is a level-up forest in extreme south west portion of the Mysidia continent too. I think it's Bab-il monsters, and the encounter rate is maxed. I think when I used Yousei's editor that's when the game started being glitchy, I know his editor expands the ROM a little. I don't use it anymore. Well, that and I haven't decided if I'm going to do most of my Hacks using FF-II versions or a J2e patched SFC version. I do like a lot of the ASM hacks J2e did, especially the menus and such and editing text in plain text rather than DTE is nice. The only thing I don't like is the huge in-battle text-dialog window, it gets in the way of the spell animations.

That doesn't surprise me... hmmm.. Babil enemies eh?.. Now you tell me...

Quote
I have not messed with the shields... After seeing the data I assumed they wouldn't work because there is no Activate/Power Byte, unless the game just gets a random garbage byte for that and tries to use it anyway...???

I think the spell power/spell effects table extends a little further for the sheilds if there is a lot of  zeros in that section... but I could be wrong. If you've ever tried targeting with the Silver/Fire/Ice/Aegis Shields, the targeting matches their magic defense which matches the associated spells in the list.

2858
General Discussion / Re: Paladin...
« on: March 13, 2008, 09:59:45 AM »
Wow you're actually playing that hack! Even I haven't played it all the way through :blush: Not even the "normal" version. I really made it to prove that I could completely change a character's sprite, that and I liked Golbez's 24x16 sprite and wanted to try out a completed version of it.

Uh oh, now I'm scared.  :tongue:

Quote
I'm not totally sure why I gave Tellah "Pray" either...LOL. I do typically use Yang's guard to fill in for most character's empty spot if they have one. I mean it's a semi-useful command and, well, there are 5 slots. I am trying more interesting stuff now though, like Cain's commands change each time he returns, he gradually acquires Yang's commands each time he defects and returns. For example he starts off with "Jump and Guard", then after Zot he has "Jump, Guard, Kick", and then after Bab-il he has "Jump, Kick, Focus/Gird". I guess I figured out a form of "Decant Ability" before Tokita and his minions built it for 4DS.  :laugh:

Well, Yang's Guard command is pretty nifty, if for no other reason to increase defense. JCE's hack changed the spell used to Blink... now if that command hit rate info is found.. that would be even more interesting...

I'm slightly pissed at Cid.. that you gave him the Steal command (I have a slight updated finding about that) and you know how useless those Cure1 potions are? Give him the Medicine Command! (I know, it's lame, but for this part of the game, it actually isn't that counterintuitive!.

Quote
Anyway, there's a lot of things I'd change in that hack knowing what I do now. First off, "Cecil" would learn black magic instead of white, since I know how to change that now. The next character-mod hack I'd really like to do is one where Cecil starts as a naval officer of sorts and then becomes the Paladin. But Cain is the dark knight for the whole game, complete with uber dark-element weapons. I'm even toying with the idea of making Yang capable of using spears and having the Jump command...

Well, Cecil casting Black Magic isn't really "out of the box"... but eh, if you keep his stat growth like a Paladin (focusing on Will Power), Palom's Boast Command actually makes a ton of sense here.

Quote
I do really appreciate the descriptions of the weapons... You've certainly got more knowledge on how they work than I. I read your posts about equipping stuff in the thread about your GameFAQs post. That's really interesting insight into how to best equip your characters, some of it is counter intuitive. Thanks for the Item data updates on some of the bytes/bits too!

Most of it is my opinion, but if you go by how the FF series (at least the SNES one) calculates attacks against defense and evade, defense has less of an impact until it is closer to the max... evade has a stronger impact in general. Even though magic defense will generally look like it is in the vicinity of suckage, the spells enemies cast on you in generally aren't powerful to begin with. It is all relative to the enemies you fight against. Maybe it's just me that I prefer to trade defense for magic defense/evade (like FF6's choice between the Genji Armor vs Force Armor... I pick the Force Armor over Genji all the time).

Quote
Well...when I get some time to update that page I'll incorporate your data into there.

Ah, cool. Those are just my opinions.. feel free to use them if you wish.

Quote
There is going to be an "Objects/Items" section on FinalFantasyIV.net, eventually, when the stars align correctly or something, that will have detailed information on every weapon/equipment/item in the game. What's holding me back is the database design (not sure how best to implement it and the relational data tables right now) that and I'm going to use scans from one of the old NTT data books to add the original concept art of each object (some of them are pretty cool). However these images are going to probably take hours to scan and days to prepare for use. Anyway, I'll definitely be able to use your data there, along with the data in from the ROM.

Ah cool.. though I'm not sure why I'm not that into the fanart for this game...

2859
I have a revised theory on Sylph's MP consumption. Other than being hardcoded, it could be classified as an "monster spell attack". Since monsters in this game can cast spells regardless of their MP, that's probably what this spell may have been classfied as somehow.

2860
General Discussion / Re: Paladin...
« on: March 13, 2008, 08:54:20 AM »
I'm still playing the hack. I don't understand why you gave Tellah Pray... I would've prefered Guard on him only because his defense gets worse every level... besides the Healing Staff (or Holy Staff that you call it) is better than Pray if only for always successful execution and it being slightly stronger.

Tellah with a Gaea Hat (Magus Hat) will heal 80-120 (Spell Multiplier of 5), which implies 20-30 when using Cure1 split against 4 characters (that the common number that this command will be used against). The Healing Staff will heal 24-36.. that's not even factoring the number of targets (since that's irrelevent) and the 100% hit rate.

2861
That's exactly what I was going to say. I've tried copying the effect data for Asura's Life spell exactly, and it doesn't work, which mean it's not contained in the effect data. It must hard-coded within the spell subroutines. If you've looked at the Tower of Bab-il documents on the spell code ASM, the subroutines do special checks for certain spells, so it's probably that way for all the little inconsistencies in the spell list.

That's not entirely surprising, like Cure4 always gives max healing when single targeting... and such stuff.

The only thing I can think of is that most summons are primarily hardcored to fail against allies only because the animation wouldn't look right (note how the effects make your characters disappear during the sequence for obvious reason). Asura kinda avoids that because there is most likely code for applying the end effect, just like how the Mist-Dragon+Ring casts a variant of Blink after being casted.

I've actually never seen the Tower of Bab-il's documents ever.  :tongue: Link?

2862
Final Fantasy IV Research & Development / Re: Barrier Status...
« on: March 13, 2008, 08:29:51 AM »
Finally got around to testing Barrier status. It turns out that the Tower of Bab-il documents were right (mostly): when you have Barrier status all physical attacks that target you fail (i.e. they miss). This includes Jump and Throw, which give the message "Nothing happened," and probably all other physical-based attacks.

AFAIK, commands like Jump and Throw intentionally fail when targeting allies. This is irrelevent to the status itself. I will have to check on physical damage.. but I don't recall noticing a difference...

Quote
The status effect also never faded. Hitting the target with magic damage or curing the target also didn't remove the status. Does the Lunar Curtain work this way?

Yes. The effect can be dispelled via Dispel or Black Hole.

Quote
The strength (or duration) of it is 14. I cast a spell that put Barrier status on with a strength of 0A, so the Lunar Curtain should last even longer. The thing is, if it doesn't fade for most or all of a battle, it seems like a pretty unfair advantage to give a character. How rare was the Lunar Curtain in the original game? It seems like it would have been extremely rare given its usefulness.

IIRC, you would need to look up the drop table. A quick check at the table shows the wierd looking cell-squid monsters that poison you drop them 50% of the the time, just not as the common drop. A number of monsters on the moon drop this version. FF4A has a chest gives that out randomly (the one that used to carry the Vishnu Vest).

2863
You know, it could simply be hardcoded. Life/Life2 is probably checking against a live person first.. whereas Asura's Life varient checks against the dead first.

By default, dead people can't be targeted by multitargeted spells, which is probably why this effect occurs.

2864
Probably.. multitargeting life only works under two instances, so there has to be something to it.

2865
Hmm.. I guess there is a problem with targeting dead targets.

Rubicante's version does work for sure, but that's dependant on magic evade (since it targets "the enemies") for success.

I'm currently guessing there is some bit that's being executed with Asura's Life1 that Life1 isn't executing...

The only thing Asura has going for her is "double effective magic power"... but Life1 doesn't seem to rely on anything unless there is spell power data I'm not aware of.