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Paladin

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #30 on: February 06, 2008, 08:05:39 PM »
Awesome! Thanks for that info Dragonsbrethren!  :happy:
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HHIPDragonFox

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #31 on: February 08, 2008, 10:56:40 AM »
 :omg:   :wtf:

Finally I found a site/forum about this type of topic.
I've been on this type of  project for over 7 months and I still can;t find the extra data strings for the weapons bit.
What is needed is the Items/weapons'  bit for selectable, equipable, sellable, usable(battle/field),throwable, range, etc.
I have an almost fully documented tbl/txt and project files awaiting review by all who needs help or could help out.


Edit(2008-02-10 5:20 am gmt-6)  :sleep:
« Last Edit: January 31, 2010, 06:10:51 AM by HHIPDragonFox »
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Deathlike2

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #32 on: March 14, 2008, 09:32:18 AM »
I'm starting to think the Axe+Hammer bits are used for a dummied command...

Quote from: Tower of Babil docs - battlemenu.txt
14 Peep  58 one ally/enemy
15 Dummy 60 (Unknown and unused command)
16 Dart  50 one ally/enemy

The command was meant for Cid.. but it never was complete.
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Dragonsbrethren

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #33 on: March 14, 2008, 11:53:17 AM »
It's certainly looking that way, originally one could have said it was for Rydia but we now know she was going to retain white magic, leaving her with no empty slots.
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Deathlike2

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #34 on: March 14, 2008, 11:57:03 AM »
Quote from: Dragonsbrethren on March 14, 2008, 11:53:17 AM
It's certainly looking that way, originally one could have said it was for Rydia but we now know she was going to retain white magic, leaving her with no empty slots.

Well, I have a cool, crazy ass, and imaginative theory.

This command was supposed to "Mechanize" the monster. When used, the monster gets the Mech attribute. That way, the hammers Cid uses don't look silly.

These bits correlate with the Ogre Axe/Hand Axe, Hammers, and Lit Arrows. These bits would "enable" this command to operate.

The Ogre Axe was probably meant to be found at the Magnetic Cave (or maybe even Cave Eblan).. but was retweaked for whatever the reason.

That's just my random cool idea for a hack today.
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Deathlike2

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #35 on: March 25, 2008, 08:30:07 AM »
Ok, I found a bug with Bit1.

Apparently the bit doesn't switch off when you have removed that weapon from the character. This implies that every character other than Edge can deal critical hits.

It would be nice if the bug is fixed.
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Deathlike2

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #36 on: March 25, 2008, 11:25:28 AM »
Never mind, I have an addendum.

Those special bits, other than metallic as far as I can tell are remembered and not unset when the weapon is unequipped.

The "disable critical hit" bit will always be enabled for Rydia since she comes back with a Whip and Rosa will always have back row compatible weaponry for every weapon he had.

In Edge's case, the back row compat bit needs to be applied to both hands in order to remove the hit rate penalty.
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Deathlike2

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #37 on: March 25, 2008, 05:48:50 PM »
Here's some related info on the back row bit, written in a separate thread - http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=455.0
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Dragonsbrethren

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #38 on: July 19, 2008, 09:23:04 PM »
:bump:

I was reading over that sourcebook bond697 linked to in the reference book site topic again and noticed something interesting - it pretty much confirms what we thought about the bit on the hammers being for a higher chance of critical hits:

Quote
Hammers
Albeit Simple Tools, Splendid Weapons in Cid's Hands
Hammers are just hammers, and in the hands of everyone but Cid, their only use is as tools.
Cid, however, with his knowledge of machines, can use these hammers as weapons. He can instantly analyze a machine's structure; since he can discover all one's weak points in a single shot, it would be advisable to use them to deliver a sudden, surprise blow to the enemy. Of course, he can also exercise this ability on non-machine-type, organic enemies.

Could just be a fancy way of explaining why Cid can use hammers as weapons, but I think it's more likely they were alluding to the fact that hammers have a higher critical hit chance than other weapons.
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Deathlike2

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #39 on: July 19, 2008, 10:34:54 PM »
I've been saying that for a while now.  :tongue:

I still don't know what the regular rate is, and what the rate is for extra bit.

My guess is 1 out of 32 normally, and 1 out of 16 or 8 with the extra bit. I'd have to do some extra testing though...
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Deathlike2

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #40 on: October 12, 2009, 09:02:18 PM »
Is there any notable behavior with Lit Arrows on Machines?

I think there would be an increased chance of critical hits or something along those lines (perhaps increased attack power?).

It would make sense since that would be most beneficial late game with all the machines (with the Evilmask at the top of the list).
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Deathlike2

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #41 on: February 12, 2012, 04:48:19 PM »
 :bump:
Ya, this is a very old bump, but I think it's worthy of some discussion.

I'm starting to think some of these unknown weapon bits "change" the frequency of the damage distribution. Rather than having an equal chance of targeting any character, it is skewed in some way.

I personally need to test this (although, it would be better if someone found code or find no reference of such code to verify this). Some of the bits are for the Axes.. probably as a "Giant" perfume or something (I can't think of a better word at the moment). Also, Cid's Hammers and the Lightning Arrows apply a similar formula. It may be harder to determine w/o having Cid (since, there are some hints that Cid would come back for the Giant event). I think he would be attracting every machine in an attempt to kick his ass (since, his weapon is designed to smash them).

That is the only logical thing I could come up with. I initially thought it would boost damage in the form of critical hits, but it might just be more obvious that it changes monster targeting... it's hard to test this theory out given some bit changing issues.

Let me know what you guys think.

 :edit:
I do not believe it affects the randomness of magic targeting....
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Shadow Flare

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #42 on: April 07, 2012, 06:19:39 AM »
 :bump:

Quote from: Deathlike2 on March 14, 2008, 09:32:18 AM
I'm starting to think the Axe+Hammer bits are used for a dummied command...

Quote from: Tower of Babil docs - battlemenu.txt
14 Peep  58 one ally/enemy
15 Dummy 60 (Unknown and unused command)
16 Dart  50 one ally/enemy

The command was meant for Cid.. but it never was complete.

Found this bit of info about Cid's second command, source provided bellow. Now we know what it was suppose to be named.

 FF4j                        FF2
ひくうてい    Airship    Dummy

"Unused in any version, but the name appears with the other commands, and the command itself is configured to target all enemies. Presumably meant to be an airstrike. Hacking it into a command list works fine, as long as you never try to use it... doing so crashes the game."

Source: http://members.fortunecity.com/kwhazit/trans/ff4/classes.html
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Deathlike2

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #43 on: April 07, 2012, 06:18:30 PM »
If that is the case, my guess is that it would have been available during the Giant event where Cid would have come back. You don't build a character that was meant to smash machines and never use him in that capacity....
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Grimoire LD

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Re: FF2/4 Unknown Weapon Bits
« Reply #44 on: April 30, 2012, 05:51:35 PM »
So have those bits been confirmed to deal something with monster targeting?

That would be interesting and make Cid a viably interesting tank.

Also that Airship command is definitely an interesting bit of news. I wonder if it can be seen what data it's trying to draw from and see if there's a way to fix it?
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