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Author Topic: FF6 Improvement Project  (Read 278338 times)

DrROBschiz

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #585 on: February 19, 2013, 01:38:52 PM »
Incredible work man!

I can't wait to play around with this more when I get a chance.

darkmage

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #586 on: February 20, 2013, 10:03:19 AM »
I did a scan for any updates to the patches I use for the improvement, and I ended up finding new fix patches from assassin and Novalia Spirit - one of which I was really glad to find.

After getting the Opera timing pretty much to my satisfaction on my translation test ROM, I played ahead and noticed that the game hung right after the scene that's supposed to be fixed with the King of Vanity patch (regressions, grr!) I had previously applied the patches that FF3usME 6.7 breaks, since I had a similar problem in Zozo when it came time for the Always Jump Left in Zozo patch and re-applying fixed it. But for some reason, the King of Vanity patch still wasn't working right.

Thankfully, Novalia Spirit has released a patch called Blush Disease to address the same issue. I removed the King of Vanity patch and applied this one, and it worked, apparently with no issues - Edgar and Celes were in the party, but only Celes blushed.

At any rate, I'll be doing an evaluation of the new fix patches and will add them in if the playtesting works out.

Something I'm on the fence about - there are two patches by HatZen08 that I would like to consider adding to the improvement (as tweaks instead of fixes, obviously), but I'm uncertain as whether it would be in the spirit of keeping as close to the original intent Square had for this game. In particular:

The Runic Forever patch causes Runic (and as a side effect, Cyan's Retort technique) to stay in effect until it is triggered, while allowing the characters to make command decisions in the meantime. While I personally like this change, and may include it in my personal copy of the improvement, my problem with officially putting this in the project is that I believe this was not the original intent for either action, so changing them will potentially make both techniques overpowered. I'll be testing this patch regardless, but I would like opinions on whether this takes the technique behavior too far away from the original behavior.

The SwordTech Ready Stance patch changes SwdTech/Bushido so that you choose the technique you want up front, and the technique will charge in the background during battle. This patch, in its current state, also changes Retort to an immediate strike once chosen. I really, REALLY like the main intent of this patch, as to me it is a much more elegant solution than the SwordTech gauge - even with the Speed-Up tweak patch I currently have in place - as it (allegedly) preserves the original charge time of each technique without breaking battle flow. The secondary effect of the patch, though, is unacceptable for the improvement as Retort was most definitely designed to counter a physical attack.

I've messaged HatZen08 to see if he would be amenable to modifying the patch. If he is, then I'm inclined to include it (barring any conflicts) because it would improve battle flow with Cyan in the party without (IMO) taking him too far away from his original design. But again, I would like opinions on that.

Please let me know what you think!

koala_knight

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #587 on: February 21, 2013, 04:18:59 PM »
If they could be adjusted so that Retort is preserved as it was intended I would include them, but I would make them optional.

binarynova

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #588 on: February 21, 2013, 10:18:33 PM »
Long time lurker here! As someone who's never posted here before I'm not sure how much my opinion means, but here it is. :)

The Runic Forever patch...

This one I don't feel one way or another towards. I never use Celes, though that may be because I've never been able to get Runic to actually do anything. I've always kind of wanted a patch that just replaced Runic with Summon or something. ;)

The SwordTech Ready Stance patch...

This one however, sounds amazing (though I agree Retort should remain a counter). I use Cyan a lot and I'm really looking forward to seeing how this feels in combat!

Anyway, I'm excited about this patch getting finished. Can't wait to play through my favorite FF again!

Leviathan Mist

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #589 on: February 22, 2013, 10:28:50 PM »
Also, I wasn't able to find anything on Twitch, but it'd be really cool to see!

Whoops, forgot to link it.

DrROBschiz

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #590 on: February 23, 2013, 08:12:51 AM »
Hatzen just added about 3-4 more patches since then

This guy is on fire... Who is he?

Not all of his stuff is gold but Ill be damned If dont mess around a bit with quite a few of them.

Its refreshing to get some new stuff to play around with and I am really glad to have the updates from you Darkmage

darkmage

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #591 on: February 23, 2013, 12:43:05 PM »
Also, I wasn't able to find anything on Twitch, but it'd be really cool to see!

Whoops, forgot to link it.

That's a cool idea, and the comments are very helpful! For instance, on part 2 with the lady in Vector who tests your loyalty - I agree that the attack if you say no should be a pincer attack. I could probably create an enemy formation that has two guards that can pincer, but there are two things about that:

1) I'm not sure which (supposedly) empty formations are safe to use - this isn't too big a hurdle, but
2) I'm not at all familiar with event editing, and I don't have the slightest idea how to find that event, much less make it call the enemy formation I could set up.

I wouldn't mind getting into event editing; there are a few event bugs that still need to be fixed, such as -

* White Drgn misplaces the room camera
* Phoenix chest in the Phoenix Cave closes again after you leave, even though it stays empty
* Music volume when you first enter the Opera House is louder than it should be

I'll take a look around and see if there's any information on how event editing works - but I admit I wouldn't be put out if someone were to point to a resource as well!


darkmage

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #592 on: February 23, 2013, 12:44:02 PM »
Hatzen just added about 3-4 more patches since then

I know, and most of them are really interesting!

Have Mog choose a dance, he does one attack from the dance routine and then goes back to being controllable? 
Make Umaro so you can equip anything on him and still have him be able to perform all his random attacks?
Reset Terra's Morph gauge to full at the end of every battle? Double magic damage done to her as an attempt to balance it out?

All of those are AWESOME ideas! But on the flipside, they're treading that line where I feel the original intent would not be preserved, and that's one of the key principles I'm trying to stick to with this mod. The SwordTech Ready stance I'm willing to use, though, since he preserves the charge time for each attack and just allows you to choose the technique when you choose the command. Doing it this way lets you work with other characters while Cyan builds up to his technique. This makes Cyan a more desirable choice, and is a change in design I'm willing to put up with. I think it's obvious I feel SwdTech is lacking, since I put in the speed-up tweak to begin with.

Speaking of the SwordTech Ready patch, HatZen sent me an alternative version where he uses some of that big area of free space in the C2 bank instead of blanking out the Retort code! There's good and bad news with this. The bad news is that, using mblock's Patch Conflict Finder, I saw that he put the majority of his 27 bytes of new code right in the same spot as Imzo's Color Coded MP patch.

The good news is that he sent his hex changes along with the patch, and using those I was able to move it to a different spot in the same area of free space that isn't being used by any of the 109 other patches I'm using. I've asked him to vet my changes, but I'm pretty sure it will work as is. So I'll be testing that soon!

That does bring up a question though: Which patch would people like to see more: the speed-up patch, or the Ready Stance patch? I'm curious as to which patch people think improves SwordTech more appropriately, or conveniently.

One tiny update: so far it looks like the extra bugfixes by assassin, Lenophis and Novalia Spirit are co-existing nicely with everything else on my test ROM, so I may be putting out another version soon!
« Last Edit: February 23, 2013, 12:56:52 PM by darkmage »

Tzepish

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #593 on: February 23, 2013, 01:46:34 PM »
I think, for these patches that would be awesome but otherwise change the intent of the game, the best of both worlds would be to do the work to make sure that they are compatible, but then distribute them in an "optional" folder contained within the same archive as the patch itself (of course, get the author's permission to do this).  The readme file could contain notes on what the patch does, why it's cool, and why it's not included in the base patch.  Personally, I'd totally use the Cyan ready stance (without breaking Retort), the forever runic, equipable umaro, and controllable coliseum, but I can see how others might disagree.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2013, 02:50:45 PM by Tzepish »

Lenophis

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #594 on: February 23, 2013, 02:25:09 PM »
2) I'm not at all familiar with event editing, and I don't have the slightest idea how to find that event, much less make it call the enemy formation I could set up.
Code: [Select]
CC/9371: C0    If ($1E80($136) [$1EA6, bit 6] is set), branch to $CC93C0
CC/9377: 4B    Display dialogue message $0532, wait for button press
               Pledge your allegiance to the Empire?
               ^ Yes
               ^ No
CC/937A: B6    Indexed branch based on prior dialogue selection [$CC93BC, $CC9382]
CC/9381: FE    Return

CC/9382: 4B    Display dialogue message $0533, wait for button press
               What!!
CC/9385: 3D    Create object $11
CC/9387: 3D    Create object $12
CC/9389: 41    Show object $11
CC/938B: 41    Show object $12
CC/938D: 45    Refresh objects
CC/938E: 31    Begin action queue for character $31 (Party Character 0), 2 bytes long
CC/9390: 1F        Do vehicle/entity graphical action $1F
CC/9391: FF        End queue
CC/9392: 11    Begin action queue for character $11 (NPC $11), 2 bytes long
CC/9394: 81        Move vehicle/entity right 1 tile
CC/9395: FF        End queue
CC/9396: 12    Begin action queue for character $12 (NPC $12), 2 bytes long (Wait until complete)
CC/9398: 83        Move vehicle/entity left 1 tile
CC/9399: FF        End queue
CC/939A: 93    Pause for 45 units
CC/939B: 4D    Invoke battle, enemy set $01, background $3F (Default for this area), (mosaic effect enabled), (swoosh sound enabled)
CC/939E: B2    Call subroutine $CA5EA9
CC/93A2: 42    Hide object $11
CC/93A4: 42    Hide object $12
CC/93A6: 45    Refresh objects
CC/93A7: 31    Begin action queue for character $31 (Party Character 0), 2 bytes long (Wait until complete)
CC/93A9: CE        Turn vehicle/entity down
CC/93AA: FF        End queue
CC/93AB: 96    Restore screen from fade
CC/93AC: 5C    Pause execution until fade in or fade out is complete
CC/93AD: 92    Pause for 30 units
CC/93AE: 31    Begin action queue for character $31 (Party Character 0), 5 bytes long (Wait until complete)
CC/93B0: CD        Turn vehicle/entity right
CC/93B1: E0        Pause for 4 * 1 (4) frames
CC/93B3: CC        Turn vehicle/entity up
CC/93B4: FF        End queue
CC/93B5: 92    Pause for 30 units
CC/93B6: 4B    Display dialogue message $0553, wait for button press
               Right…
               I'm sure you can do it!
CC/93B9: D2    Set event bit $1E80($136) [$1EA6, bit 6]
CC/93BB: FE    Return
The line you want is CC/939B. 4D 01 3F should be 4D xx 3F (xx is your new 2-pack formation).

119 bugs fixed and counting.

koala_knight

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #595 on: February 23, 2013, 05:33:44 PM »
I totally support the Ready Stance patch over the speed tweak.
And I agree with Tzepish's suggestion of an optional patches folder.

darkmage

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #596 on: February 23, 2013, 08:41:02 PM »
Hmm...the folder of optional but awesome patches is a good idea. There are a couple of other patches I could think of that I would like to endorse as a quality addition to the improvement mod. I'll get the list together and ask the authors for permission, and as long as they're OK with it I'll pack them together in the archive.

Thanks for pointing that event out, Leno! Is there a "basics" thread or other doc for event editing? I'm more than willing to do the research, but I'm not sure where to start looking where the events are concerned.

I'll get the SwordTech Ready Stance patch included in place of the speed-up tweak and start testing it right away.

Thanks for all the feedback and advice!

Lenophis

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #597 on: February 24, 2013, 08:11:55 AM »
Is there a "basics" thread or other doc for event editing? I'm more than willing to do the research, but I'm not sure where to start looking where the events are concerned.
You can pretty much find all of them in the Event dump at Imzog's site. The best way to find an event is to find something unique to it, dialogue works best. The rest should fall into place.

119 bugs fixed and counting.

DrROBschiz

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #598 on: February 25, 2013, 02:51:17 PM »
I have found that your base patch can combine nicely with quite a few of the difficulty patches out there. Mainly SageAcrins Eviltype (for the most part)

Ill have to test again with all the recent changes but it should be lots of fun to make a sort of super patch that has enough changes to keep things fresh while still maintaining the original spirit of the game

Hatzens patches seem almost tailored to be combined with difficulty patches in order to make the players options and strategies more compelling.

darkmage

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #599 on: February 27, 2013, 11:31:18 AM »
From playtesting, what I can see is that the Ready Stance patch is not fundamentally different from the Speed-Up patch - the gauge fills faster than before in both patches. What is different is that as you choose higher number techniques, the wait time between choice and execution is longer. So there won't be as noticeable difference to players as I was expecting.

Also, the translation appears to have some rough edges I hadn't caught since my last revision - I'm fixing those as I find them.