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Deathlike2

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Paladin...
« on: March 10, 2008, 06:58:27 PM »
Are you the same guy who wrote the Golbez-Cecil hack?

Anyways.. your site is nice (you posted a link to a document on your website, which is incomplete.. if you need a little help there to figure it out, I'll see what I can come up with... anyways I did bother to check your site out in the meantime). The only issue I have is that a bunch of weapon descriptions are.. not quite right. For instance, the Avenger Sword is not Holy elemental... however those translating FF4 (the J2e guys) somehow thought it was Holy elemental.. go figure.

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Paladin

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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #1 on: March 12, 2008, 09:08:39 AM »
Yo...

Well...if you mean the Golbez-Cecil hack here, then yeah thats me. Heh...it's more of a cheap graphics hack than anything else... But that's some of the first stuff I ever tried to do.

FinalFantasyIV.net is really under a lot of (random) construction on my part. My previous FF4 sites were all static HTML monstrosities that were never complete and impossible to really update. This time I'm building it right with a SQL backend and a custom CMS for data entry and maintenance. It's all custom, none of that is portal software. But who knows when it will ever be completed. One of the ladies at Sygnus.org helps me with some of the story content, but that's what they're about there mostly is the story and characters etc...(although this particular friend has interests in the game across the board)...anyway...she gives me a lot of good insights from a fan writers perspective and she has connections to the Japanese fan base. The ROM hacking side of FF4, and what a lot of you here are doing, is just as important because it reveals the inner workings of the game and a lot of valuable information as well. With the data in Yousei's document, in the Bab-il papers, and the various contributions I've seen here I've been able to scrape out all kinds of cool tables from the ROM. Like a the item drops for monsters, and the definitive data on the weapons, items, and magic. Just to mention a couple.

You are correct, some of the data in that weapons article is outdated. I wrote a lot of that before I decoded the status attributes of the weapons, so I did indeed go by J2e's data for the Avenger Sword. I will need to rewrite and revise parts of that document. But that's why I'm using a database now. I can go in my CMS and edit that content pretty easily...which is the whole point. I want the data on the site to be correct. Any suggestions for revisions you'd like to make are totally cool. I suppose you can just post it here...but you can eMail me if you want >>> paladin [at] paladinet [dot] com

As for that items hacking document. Yes I've really updated that now, the version online needs to be replaced (I'll do that here after a while). I've found so much valuable information here that I pretty much spent about three whole weeks last month just compiling new data into spreadsheets. I have a huge monster of a spreadsheet for all the offsets I know now. It's not complete yet but when it gets there I'll share that out, especially since a lot of the data was supplemented by the data revealed in the discussions here.

<edit>
I uploaded the most recent version of my "Item Compendium" document. Same URL as before:
http://www.finalfantasyiv.net/emulation/documents/itemcompendium.xls
</edit>
« Last Edit: March 12, 2008, 11:18:07 AM by Paladin »

Deathlike2

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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #2 on: March 12, 2008, 09:29:02 AM »
Yo...

Well...if you mean the Golbez-Cecil hack here, then yeah thats me. Heh...it's more of a cheap graphics hack than anything else... But that's some of the first stuff I ever tried to do.

Ironically my FF4 regular playthrough is kinda on hiatus as I'm playing your hack. It's a little glitchy though when the battles starts (dunno what's causing that).

Quote
FinalFantasyIV.net is really under a lot of (random) construction on my part. My previous FF4 sites were all static HTML monstrosities that were never complete and impossible to really update. This time I'm building it right with a SQL backend and a custom CMS for data entry and maintenance. It's all custom, none of that is portal software. But who knows when it will ever be completed. One of the ladies at Sygnus.org helps me with some of the story content, but that's what they're about there mostly is the story and characters etc...(although this particular friend has interests in the game across the board)...anyway...she gives me a lot of good insights from a fan writers perspective and she has connections to the Japanese fan base. The ROM hacking side of FF4, and what a lot of you here are doing, is just as important because it reveals the inner workings of the game and a lot of valuable information as well. With the data in Yousei's document, in the Bab-il papers, and the various contributions I've seen here I've been able to scrape out all kinds of cool tables from the ROM. Like a the item drops for monsters, and the definitive data on the weapons, items, and magic. Just to mention a couple.

Well, there will be the day when all of this gets done.. (which is probably never  :tongue:) It's nice that a game is always under some sort of research unlike CT (where any idiot can make a hack).

Quote
You are correct, some of the data in that weapons article is outdated. I wrote a lot of that before I decoded the status attributes of the weapons, so I did indeed go by J2e's data for the Avenger Sword. I will need to rewrite and revise parts of that document. But that's why I'm using a database now. I can go in my CMS and edit that content pretty easily...which is the whole point. I want the data on the site to be correct. Any suggestions for revisions you'd like to make are totally cool. I suppose you can just post it here...but you can eMail me if you want >>> paladin [at] paladinet [dot] com

I'll probably post it here at some point. My brain is still trying to wrap around frequent Remedy drops that sell for 20000+ GP.  :tongue:

Quote
As for that items hacking document. Yes I've really updated that now, the version online needs to be replaced (I'll do that here after a while). I've found so much valuable information here that I pretty much spent about three whole weeks last month just compiling new data into spreadsheets. I have a huge monster of a spreadsheet for all the offsets I know now. It's not complete yet but when it gets there I'll share that out, especially since a lot of the data was supplemented by the data revealed in the discussions here.

Yea... finding romhackers that hack the same game and still not know enough about the game almost sounds ironic and mystifying. Oh well, we have time.  :wink:
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Deathlike2

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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #3 on: March 12, 2008, 12:13:46 PM »
<edit>
I uploaded the most recent version of my "Item Compendium" document. Same URL as before:
http://www.finalfantasyiv.net/emulation/documents/itemcompendium.xls
</edit>

Looks good... I'll have to dissect the spell power of the items at some point to see if any of that even makes sense to me.

I've kinda concluded that item magic has a hit rate of 100%, overriding whatever spell hit rate data it is basing itself on.

Some descriptions of the weapons:

Lightbringer: How to get this and the Caliburn is documented in the FF4A Lunar Ruins guide for Cecil's trial. It's the weapon given to you if you successfully passed all the tests.

Caliburn: It's a play-on-word thing that should be obvious that failure was achieved.

Avenger Sword: Being under Berserk status increases your damage output by 50%... and perhaps one of the better weapons for Kain for FF4.

Slumber Sword: Sleep can be cast by the weapon. The spell's effectiveness under this weapon is primarily driven by level.

Blood Sword/Spear: It is very effective against flan/pudding monsters and Giants. The only monster worth worrying about is the undead and particular FF4A's undead flan monster (I forget its name off the top of my head, but that monster can be found on the "flan" level and in the FF4A beastiary...)

The "Piglet Sword" is aka Piggy's Stick in FF4A. The one found in FF4ET is found in the pot in the pathway between you and Odin at Baron. The one in FF4A is found in the "Chocobo Forest" in the Lunar Ruins. Both have a chance to inflict piggy status on attack.

Abel's Lance: It's Kain's "ultimate weapon" in FF4A. It's simply overpowered. Lightning elemental.. and one of the few spears (like the Blood Spear) that does NOT have the Aerial attribute (I feel that's a bug, but I digress...). It has a random chance of casting Tornado.. which relies on Kain and the target's level. This version of Tornado ignores the boss bit, making it grossly overpowered. This is picked up after the successful completion of Kain's trial.

Blood Spear/Lance: One of the treasures dropped by one of the monster-laden treasures in Eblana Castle. This weapon IMO is weaker than the Blood Sword (not by much) because of its atrocious hit rate.

Hand Axe: Probably was meant to be available when you got Cid, so figure.  It is never normally available in all versions up to FF4A (FF4DS is unknown AFAIK).

Rune Axe: It is dropped by those Giant-mechanical-like monsters. You have the best chance of acquiring one during the Giant when the Searcher monster summons a MacGiant. This weapon is the anti-mage killer. It is unfortunately 2 handed.

Mute Knife: It's not really that great with Rydia. It is relatively beneficial for Edge most of all, because he wields two weapons and has the strength to kill mage enemies at a whim.

Lilith Rod: It has a greater spell multiplier than Tellah's starting Wisdom, so it's actually a significant improvement, plus you don't have to wait for the Pysch/Osmose spell to be cast.

One other thing, there should be a byte designated specifically for certain items (Ether1, Ether2, Elixir) that makes them sell for 1 GP... they don't have a 1/2 sale price.

Byte 0 for the weapons extra attribute (as far as I'm concerned) is the "prevent critical hit byte". If you've ever noticed while using those weapons, critical hits never occur. I forget if Dragonsbrethren confirmed that. Byte 5 for the weapons enemy bonus is for flan/pudding monsters.

Also, the spell based items.. the ? is the spell hit rate... with the highest bit (bit 7) is the "boss bit" (when set, it doesn't work vs bosses). This bit also applies to the spell hit rate list.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2008, 12:40:04 PM by Deathlike2 »
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Entroper

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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2008, 02:26:08 PM »

Blood Sword/Spear: It is very effective against flan/pudding monsters and Giants. The only monster worth worrying about is the undead and particular FF4A's undead flan monster (I forget its name off the top of my head, but that monster can be found on the "flan" level and in the FF4A beastiary...)

Dust Mousse, I think.  No need to fear these guys though; they're weak against holy.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2008, 02:31:21 PM by Entroper »

Deathlike2

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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #5 on: March 12, 2008, 04:15:41 PM »
Paladin, have you looked into testing the shields and see if they use the spell power byte...? It seems to me that they can carry a spell based on their Magic Defense value.

I've been able to do strange targeting with Shields, so I suspect there is a correlation of sorts.
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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2008, 04:52:40 AM »
Caliburn: It's a play-on-word thing that should be obvious that failure was achieved.

And in the Japanese version and a few of the European translations it's the Excalipur/Excalipoor. Personally I kinda liked Caliburn, in addition to being a play on words (A far better one than "Excalipoor") it's also an alternate name for Excalibur, I was hoping they'd keep it for FF5 and FF6 Advance. I used Caliburn in my old unfinished FF1 hacks instead of "Xcalbur" for that same reason.

Hand Axe: Probably was meant to be available when you got Cid, so figure.  It is never normally available in all versions up to FF4A (FF4DS is unknown AFAIK).

If it's in FF4 DS I didn't find it.

[spoiler]I did find the Black Tail, dropped by RedGiants, which gets you the Onion Armor when you give it to the tail collector. :happy:[/spoiler]

Deathlike2

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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #7 on: March 13, 2008, 08:54:20 AM »
I'm still playing the hack. I don't understand why you gave Tellah Pray... I would've prefered Guard on him only because his defense gets worse every level... besides the Healing Staff (or Holy Staff that you call it) is better than Pray if only for always successful execution and it being slightly stronger.

Tellah with a Gaea Hat (Magus Hat) will heal 80-120 (Spell Multiplier of 5), which implies 20-30 when using Cure1 split against 4 characters (that the common number that this command will be used against). The Healing Staff will heal 24-36.. that's not even factoring the number of targets (since that's irrelevent) and the 100% hit rate.
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Paladin

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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #8 on: March 13, 2008, 09:47:49 AM »
Wow you're actually playing that hack! Even I haven't played it all the way through :blush: Not even the "normal" version. I really made it to prove that I could completely change a character's sprite, that and I liked Golbez's 24x16 sprite and wanted to try out a completed version of it.

Yeah...there's some weird stuff in that hack. I don't think I fixed the "Rosa x Cecil" embrace sprite (ya know, after you save her in Zot)...that may be screwed up. I also used Yousei's map editor to do some funky stuff with the world map. When you get the hovercraft you can pretty much access the entire world map using strategically placed shoals, just don't go places you shouldn't early (like talk to the king of Fabul) or the game will eventually screw up. There is a level-up forest in extreme south west portion of the Mysidia continent too. I think it's Bab-il monsters, and the encounter rate is maxed. I think when I used Yousei's editor that's when the game started being glitchy, I know his editor expands the ROM a little. I don't use it anymore. Well, that and I haven't decided if I'm going to do most of my Hacks using FF-II versions or a J2e patched SFC version. I do like a lot of the ASM hacks J2e did, especially the menus and such and editing text in plain text rather than DTE is nice. The only thing I don't like is the huge in-battle text-dialog window, it gets in the way of the spell animations.

I'm not totally sure why I gave Tellah "Pray" either...LOL. I do typically use Yang's guard to fill in for most character's empty spot if they have one. I mean it's a semi-useful command and, well, there are 5 slots. I am trying more interesting stuff now though, like Cain's commands change each time he returns, he gradually acquires Yang's commands each time he defects and returns. For example he starts off with "Jump and Guard", then after Zot he has "Jump, Guard, Kick", and then after Bab-il he has "Jump, Kick, Focus/Gird". I guess I figured out a form of "Decant Ability" before Tokita and his minions built it for 4DS.  :laugh:

Anyway, there's a lot of things I'd change in that hack knowing what I do now. First off, "Cecil" would learn black magic instead of white, since I know how to change that now. The next character-mod hack I'd really like to do is one where Cecil starts as a naval officer of sorts and then becomes the Paladin. But Cain is the dark knight for the whole game, complete with uber dark-element weapons. I'm even toying with the idea of making Yang capable of using spears and having the Jump command...

I do really appreciate the descriptions of the weapons... You've certainly got more knowledge on how they work than I. I read your posts about equipping stuff in the thread about your GameFAQs post. That's really interesting insight into how to best equip your characters, some of it is counter intuitive. Thanks for the Item data updates on some of the bytes/bits too!
Well...when I get some time to update that page I'll incorporate your data into there.

I have not messed with the shields... After seeing the data I assumed they wouldn't work because there is no Activate/Power Byte, unless the game just gets a random garbage byte for that and tries to use it anyway...???

There is going to be an "Objects/Items" section on FinalFantasyIV.net, eventually, when the stars align correctly or something, that will have detailed information on every weapon/equipment/item in the game. What's holding me back is the database design (not sure how best to implement it and the relational data tables right now) that and I'm going to use scans from one of the old NTT data books to add the original concept art of each object (some of them are pretty cool). However these images are going to probably take hours to scan and days to prepare for use. Anyway, I'll definitely be able to use your data there, along with the data in from the ROM.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2008, 10:05:46 AM by Paladin »

Deathlike2

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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #9 on: March 13, 2008, 09:59:45 AM »
Wow you're actually playing that hack! Even I haven't played it all the way through :blush: Not even the "normal" version. I really made it to prove that I could completely change a character's sprite, that and I liked Golbez's 24x16 sprite and wanted to try out a completed version of it.

Uh oh, now I'm scared.  :tongue:

Quote
I'm not totally sure why I gave Tellah "Pray" either...LOL. I do typically use Yang's guard to fill in for most character's empty spot if they have one. I mean it's a semi-useful command and, well, there are 5 slots. I am trying more interesting stuff now though, like Cain's commands change each time he returns, he gradually acquires Yang's commands each time he defects and returns. For example he starts off with "Jump and Guard", then after Zot he has "Jump, Guard, Kick", and then after Bab-il he has "Jump, Kick, Focus/Gird". I guess I figured out a form of "Decant Ability" before Tokita and his minions built it for 4DS.  :laugh:

Well, Yang's Guard command is pretty nifty, if for no other reason to increase defense. JCE's hack changed the spell used to Blink... now if that command hit rate info is found.. that would be even more interesting...

I'm slightly pissed at Cid.. that you gave him the Steal command (I have a slight updated finding about that) and you know how useless those Cure1 potions are? Give him the Medicine Command! (I know, it's lame, but for this part of the game, it actually isn't that counterintuitive!.

Quote
Anyway, there's a lot of things I'd change in that hack knowing what I do now. First off, "Cecil" would learn black magic instead of white, since I know how to change that now. The next character-mod hack I'd really like to do is one where Cecil starts as a naval officer of sorts and then becomes the Paladin. But Cain is the dark knight for the whole game, complete with uber dark-element weapons. I'm even toying with the idea of making Yang capable of using spears and having the Jump command...

Well, Cecil casting Black Magic isn't really "out of the box"... but eh, if you keep his stat growth like a Paladin (focusing on Will Power), Palom's Boast Command actually makes a ton of sense here.

Quote
I do really appreciate the descriptions of the weapons... You've certainly got more knowledge on how they work than I. I read your posts about equipping stuff in the thread about your GameFAQs post. That's really interesting insight into how to best equip your characters, some of it is counter intuitive. Thanks for the Item data updates on some of the bytes/bits too!

Most of it is my opinion, but if you go by how the FF series (at least the SNES one) calculates attacks against defense and evade, defense has less of an impact until it is closer to the max... evade has a stronger impact in general. Even though magic defense will generally look like it is in the vicinity of suckage, the spells enemies cast on you in generally aren't powerful to begin with. It is all relative to the enemies you fight against. Maybe it's just me that I prefer to trade defense for magic defense/evade (like FF6's choice between the Genji Armor vs Force Armor... I pick the Force Armor over Genji all the time).

Quote
Well...when I get some time to update that page I'll incorporate your data into there.

Ah, cool. Those are just my opinions.. feel free to use them if you wish.

Quote
There is going to be an "Objects/Items" section on FinalFantasyIV.net, eventually, when the stars align correctly or something, that will have detailed information on every weapon/equipment/item in the game. What's holding me back is the database design (not sure how best to implement it and the relational data tables right now) that and I'm going to use scans from one of the old NTT data books to add the original concept art of each object (some of them are pretty cool). However these images are going to probably take hours to scan and days to prepare for use. Anyway, I'll definitely be able to use your data there, along with the data in from the ROM.

Ah cool.. though I'm not sure why I'm not that into the fanart for this game...
« Last Edit: March 13, 2008, 10:29:17 AM by Deathlike2 »
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Deathlike2

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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #10 on: March 13, 2008, 10:32:30 AM »
Yeah...there's some weird stuff in that hack. I don't think I fixed the "Rosa x Cecil" embrace sprite (ya know, after you save her in Zot)...that may be screwed up. I also used Yousei's map editor to do some funky stuff with the world map. When you get the hovercraft you can pretty much access the entire world map using strategically placed shoals, just don't go places you shouldn't early (like talk to the king of Fabul) or the game will eventually screw up. There is a level-up forest in extreme south west portion of the Mysidia continent too. I think it's Bab-il monsters, and the encounter rate is maxed. I think when I used Yousei's editor that's when the game started being glitchy, I know his editor expands the ROM a little. I don't use it anymore. Well, that and I haven't decided if I'm going to do most of my Hacks using FF-II versions or a J2e patched SFC version. I do like a lot of the ASM hacks J2e did, especially the menus and such and editing text in plain text rather than DTE is nice. The only thing I don't like is the huge in-battle text-dialog window, it gets in the way of the spell animations.

That doesn't surprise me... hmmm.. Babil enemies eh?.. Now you tell me...

Quote
I have not messed with the shields... After seeing the data I assumed they wouldn't work because there is no Activate/Power Byte, unless the game just gets a random garbage byte for that and tries to use it anyway...???

I think the spell power/spell effects table extends a little further for the sheilds if there is a lot of  zeros in that section... but I could be wrong. If you've ever tried targeting with the Silver/Fire/Ice/Aegis Shields, the targeting matches their magic defense which matches the associated spells in the list.
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Paladin

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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #11 on: March 13, 2008, 12:25:16 PM »
Quote
Uh oh, now I'm scared.  :tongue:

Heh...well if you play it through to the end, let me know how it went... :tongue:

Quote
I'm slightly pissed at Cid.. that you gave him the Steal command (I have a slight updated finding about that) and you know how useless those Cure1 potions are? Give him the Medicine Command! (I know, it's lame, but for this part of the game, it actually isn't that counterintuitive!.

Ah...they're even more useless when wasting Edge's turns to steal them... :laugh:
Actually I think you've hit on something. How about both Medicine and Steal. That way he can steal a ton of Cure1's and then use them on the entire party  :omg: I kind of like that idea.

Oh and I noticed you mentioned the heals and their exorbitant sale price...yeah...LOL. That's because I forgot to fix the drop list and I didn't have the treasure offsets either. Any future FF-II hacks will correct this. I do have a "start-up" hack I'm working on that sets FF-II back to a baseline where the enemies drop what they did in FF-IV Normal, and I'm going to go through and set the treasure chests back to FF-IV normal.

Quote
Well, Cecil casting Black Magic isn't really "out of the box"... but eh, if you keep his stat growth like a Paladin (focusing on Will Power), Palom's Boast Command actually makes a ton of sense here.

Well, at the time I didn't know where the natural magic learnt tables were. Actually I didn't find them until I saw the offsets in JCE's "Feel the Need to Contribute" thread. Heh...actually when I found this forum I had spent some time the previous Saturday leveling up Little Rydia one level at a time using FF4h so I could get a list of her "Magic Learnt", so I could attempt to look for a hex string that would match the list of spells... So thanks to JCE for saving me some work!

I've actually played with those some and found that you can use that "unused" magic list. If you give it spells and then map it to a magic command the character will "learn" the spells when they level up. I mapped it Cain and it worked just fine. The only problem I've run into is A) Characters like Cain, Cid, etc... Don't gain MP as they level up (so far I've hacked the Save to make it work) and B)I don't know how to tell the game that a character can use magic, so that you can see the list in the game menu when you pick "Magic" and the character.

I also found that the game is trying to Map FuSoYa's magic menu's to the Golbez character record but they got it wrong and mapped them to Anna. Not that it matters, you can't use either character normally anyway. But it explains why the Golbez character has Black and White magic enabled in the menu. Obviously you can fix it and Golbez could then cast magic.

The stat growth though, is something I hadn't thought of, his wisdom would be a little off... Although I kind of like the fact that his casting black magic would not be as powerful as a true black mage. But you have a good idea there, adding the boast command  to power up in a pinch.

See...I like those handicaps. From now on my hacks are going to make the enemies stronger so the game difficulty is raised a notch. Basically because I can pwn every commercial copy of it. I thought it was way too easy to hit LV99 in FF4 Advance. Now FF5...busting the characters up to LV99 in that game takes some work. That's what I'm looking for. That and it's too bad that the (SNES) game is stuck dealing only 9999 max damage. It would be more fun if spells like Flare, Holy, and Meteo could really do some serious damage instead of your fighters and mages converging on that blasted quad-9 number to where using magic is almost a waste of time...

I haven't played a ton of FF4DS yet, but people that have told me that the difficulty has really been turned up and the characters, even with the Lunar Weapons, aren't godly anymore in that game.

Quote
That doesn't surprise me... hmmm.. Babil enemies eh?.. Now you tell me...

Heh...sorry... I had the idea of really suping up Dark Knight Cecil, Little Rydia, or even 'ol Eddie (!) just for kicks, and having a good place to go once you have Enterprise with like Cid and Yang to bust some levels before Zot and the Underground...

Quote
I think the spell power/spell effects table extends a little further for the sheilds if there is a lot of  zeros in that section... but I could be wrong. If you've ever tried targeting with the Silver/Fire/Ice/Aegis Shields, the targeting matches their magic defense which matches the associated spells in the list.

Actually...yeah you're right. I checked the ROM document I have here with me and it looks like there are 48 bytes free at the end of the weapon magic activators table. $097270-2CF w/Header... Then $0792D0-2FF are empty. I don't have the ROM in front of me but I think they are just $00 but could be $FF's my notes don't specifiy (Probably $00 since the shields don't cast anything). It's worth messing with.  :omghax:
« Last Edit: March 13, 2008, 01:01:52 PM by Paladin »

Deathlike2

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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #12 on: March 13, 2008, 01:54:43 PM »
Quote
I'm slightly pissed at Cid.. that you gave him the Steal command (I have a slight updated finding about that) and you know how useless those Cure1 potions are? Give him the Medicine Command! (I know, it's lame, but for this part of the game, it actually isn't that counterintuitive!.

Ah...they're even more useless when wasting Edge's turns to steal them... :laugh:
Actually I think you've hit on something. How about both Medicine and Steal. That way he can steal a ton of Cure1's and then use them on the entire party  :omg: I kind of like that idea.

That was the idea..  :tongue: That would've been my only suggestion to JCE's hack actually, since he removed that command in favor of Steal, but ironically they ideally work together.

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I've actually played with those some and found that you can use that "unused" magic list. If you give it spells and then map it to a magic command the character will "learn" the spells when they level up. I mapped it Cain and it worked just fine. The only problem I've run into is A) Characters like Cain, Cid, etc... Don't gain MP as they level up (so far I've hacked the Save to make it work) and B)I don't know how to tell the game that a character can use magic, so that you can see the list in the game menu when you pick "Magic" and the character.

We already have that thread... but it's somewhere deep in a post in the FF4 research forum. Probably a good idea to use the search feature if necessary. One is for the level up data.. the other is for adding magic for those that don't have it.

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I also found that the game is trying to Map FuSoYa's magic menu's to the Golbez character record but they got it wrong and mapped them to Anna. Not that it matters, you can't use either character normally anyway. But it explains why the Golbez character has Black and White magic enabled in the menu. Obviously you can fix it and Golbez could then cast magic.

You know, it makes me almost think they scripted that final battle intentionally, only because they royally fucked up according to your description.


Edit:

I do really appreciate the descriptions of the weapons... You've certainly got more knowledge on how they work than I. I read your posts about equipping stuff in the thread about your GameFAQs post. That's really interesting insight into how to best equip your characters, some of it is counter intuitive. Thanks for the Item data updates on some of the bytes/bits too!
Well...when I get some time to update that page I'll incorporate your data into there.

Well, if you have random questions that I occasionally do, feel free to ask. I have thoughts on killing Asura w/o using Reflect/Wall (and I'm pretty sure it won't involve overleveling) and why the Genji set of equipment is near useless to me.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2008, 02:24:34 PM by Deathlike2 »
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Paladin

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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #13 on: March 13, 2008, 03:58:00 PM »
Quote
We already have that thread... but it's somewhere deep in a post in the FF4 research forum. Probably a good idea to use the search feature if necessary. One is for the level up data.. the other is for adding magic for those that don't have it.

Found it: http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=169.0...looks like JCE had the level data and Phoenix decoded the menu part of it. Nice work!



Quote
You know, it makes me almost think they scripted that final battle intentionally, only because they royally fucked up according to your description.

I think they fucked up a lot of things with the characters. I mean it's AFU with Golbez and Anna.

In the sprite table "Piggy" is Chr#14, Golbez is Chr#15, and Anna is Chr#16. With Golbez and Anna being "half" complete sprites.

The palettes for the sprites are disordered at the end too. Golbez is palette 14, Anna's battle sprite is #15 and it's garbage colors. Another Palette is #16 which is the actual palette for Anna but it is only used in the Kaipo Waterhag battle apparition.

For some stupid reason in the magic lists Golbez comes as Character #16, and Anna is actually #15 (I've tested it to be sure). The developers pointed the Fu spells at character 15 so Golbez doesn't have any. WTF?

The Avatars at the end (after Fu) are #14 "Piggy", #15 "Midget", #15 "Toad". Which seems to make sense for Golbez since if you put him in a party his avatar is "Midget" and it references an all black palette (which is correct for golbez if he had an Avatar). In fact you could probably dummy out the Minimize spell from the game and make Golbez nearly playable, with even an avatar.

I can understand why Golbez has a character, if for no other reason than for the game engine to use him in a battle at the end (intentionally scripted or not), but Anna...why? My only guess is that Anna was originally supposed to be playable in some way? Perhaps there was a whole scenario created and then cut from the Damcyan Invasion sequence, in which Anna was playable or was at least scripted in a battle sequence.

Anyway, it looks like a bunch of development garbage that was left behind or never finished to me. That or when the decided to create the "Piggy" effect for the characters and that's when they used the actual data originally created as a character.

Anna's sprite, as it stands, has action squares and palette that can be used, I've "fixed" them. Well the hack of mine you have should be "fixed" in that manner.

It just seems like so much was hacked and rushed with this game...I have also learned something else about FF4DS that is fucked...that IMO was "hacked" in the original and should have been fixed:
[spoiler]The Tower of Zot is again NOT shown. That's bullshit. They should have taken the time to finally show us what it was. I'm told that the consensus among Japanese players is that it is a floating fortress that orbits too high in the sky to be noticed. Hell...FF5 has a floating fortress and FF6 has a floating CONTINENT. You'd think in the DS game they could have taken the time to finally show us Zot. 
:lame:[/spoiler]

Quote
Most of it is my opinion, but if you go by how the FF series (at least the SNES one) calculates attacks against defense and evade, defense has less of an impact until it is closer to the max... evade has a stronger impact in general. Even though magic defense will generally look like it is in the vicinity of suckage, the spells enemies cast on you in generally aren't powerful to begin with. It is all relative to the enemies you fight against. Maybe it's just me that I prefer to trade defense for magic defense/evade (like FF6's choice between the Genji Armor vs Force Armor... I pick the Force Armor over Genji all the time).

I forgot this bit before. But, yes I agree with you on FF6. I learned a long time ago that the Force Equipment does a better job. Edgar is my #1 in that game, and even though the characters get godlike in that game at high levels anyway, I figured out how to turn Edgar (it would work for like Tina, Celes, or anyone else that can naturally use swords and heavy equipment), into a one-man slaughter factory:

Helmet: Something Decent?
Armor: Force Armor
Shield: Paladin Shield
Weapon: Atma Weapon
Relic1: Offering
Relic2: Something Good, like Economizer or Gem Box or Marvel Shoes

With the Force Armor and Paladin Shield he almost can't get hit with any kind of magic attack and physical attacks don't do much. At levels 70 or greater Atma weapon is either so powerful (or just plain ignores) the x/4 penalty of the Offering and can, at high levels, hit 4x for 9999-DMG. Even Ultima + Gem Box is no match for his destructive power. For more fun give him a Genji Glove and another uber sword like Ragnarok, Excalibur, or Scimitar and, well, you get the idea. I hate the stock Illumina though, since it rapes you of your MP to hit harder (and even worse with an Offering). I turn off the MP suckage for it in my hacks on that game.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2008, 04:29:27 PM by Paladin »

Deathlike2

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Re: Paladin...
« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2008, 04:52:20 PM »
Quote
We already have that thread... but it's somewhere deep in a post in the FF4 research forum. Probably a good idea to use the search feature if necessary. One is for the level up data.. the other is for adding magic for those that don't have it.

Found it: http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=169.0...looks like JCE had the level data and Phoenix decoded the menu part of it. Nice work!

There's another thread on improving the palette/graphics for the menus. A hack with that knowledge would look that much more awesome (especially with FF4 looking rather dated in relation to its SNES breathren).

Quote
Quote
You know, it makes me almost think they scripted that final battle intentionally, only because they royally fucked up according to your description.

I think they fucked up a lot of things with the characters. I mean it's AFU with Golbez and Anna.

In the sprite table "Piggy" is Chr#14, Golbez is Chr#15, and Anna is Chr#16. With Golbez and Anna being "half" complete sprites.

The palettes for the sprites are disordered at the end too. Golbez is palette 14, Anna's battle sprite is #15 and it's garbage colors. Another Palette is #16 which is the actual palette for Anna but it is only used in the Kaipo Waterhag battle apparition.

For some stupid reason in the magic lists Golbez comes as Character #16, and Anna is actually #15 (I've tested it to be sure). The developers pointed the Fu spells at character 15 so Golbez doesn't have any. WTF?

The Avatars at the end (after Fu) are #14 "Piggy", #15 "Midget", #15 "Toad". Which seems to make sense for Golbez since if you put him in a party his avatar is "Midget" and it references an all black palette (which is correct for golbez if he had an Avatar). In fact you could probably dummy out the Minimize spell from the game and make Golbez nearly playable, with even an avatar.

I can understand why Golbez has a character, if for no other reason than for the game engine to use him in a battle at the end (intentionally scripted or not), but Anna...why? My only guess is that Anna was originally supposed to be playable in some way? Perhaps there was a whole scenario created and then cut from the Damcyan Invasion sequence, in which Anna was playable or was at least scripted in a battle sequence.

Anyway, it looks like a bunch of development garbage that was left behind or never finished to me. That or when the decided to create the "Piggy" effect for the characters and that's when they used the actual data originally created as a character.

Anna's sprite, as it stands, has action squares and palette that can be used, I've "fixed" them. Well the hack of mine you have should be "fixed" in that manner.

AFAIK, it could be to save space, but I could be totally wrong on that. Anna-Edward really should have a sequence.. given that the dialog hints to that. The Cover command can probably, so that's not the issue. The issue would most likely be trying to show enemies spitting arrows at you.

Quote
It just seems like so much was hacked and rushed with this game...I have also learned something else about FF4DS that is fucked...that IMO was "hacked" in the original and should have been fixed:
[spoiler]The Tower of Zot is again NOT shown. That's bullshit. They should have taken the time to finally show us what it was. I'm told that the consensus among Japanese players is that it is a floating fortress that orbits too high in the sky to be noticed. Hell...FF5 has a floating fortress and FF6 has a floating CONTINENT. You'd think in the DS game they could have taken the time to finally show us Zot. 
:lame:[/spoiler]

That's not new news, but I agree. Although, I'm surprised it wasn't added in the DS game. I suspect it has something to do with the overworld map and flying objects though in the original game...

Quote
Quote
Most of it is my opinion, but if you go by how the FF series (at least the SNES one) calculates attacks against defense and evade, defense has less of an impact until it is closer to the max... evade has a stronger impact in general. Even though magic defense will generally look like it is in the vicinity of suckage, the spells enemies cast on you in generally aren't powerful to begin with. It is all relative to the enemies you fight against. Maybe it's just me that I prefer to trade defense for magic defense/evade (like FF6's choice between the Genji Armor vs Force Armor... I pick the Force Armor over Genji all the time).

I forgot this bit before. But, yes I agree with you on FF6. I learned a long time ago that the Force Equipment does a better job. Edgar is my #1 in that game, and even though the characters get godlike in that game at high levels anyway, I figured out how to turn Edgar (it would work for like Tina, Celes, or anyone else that can naturally use swords and heavy equipment), into a one-man slaughter factory:

Helmet: Something Decent?
Armor: Force Armor
Shield: Paladin Shield
Weapon: Atma Weapon
Relic1: Offering
Relic2: Something Good, like Economizer or Gem Box or Marvel Shoes

With the Force Armor and Paladin Shield he almost can't get hit with any kind of magic attack and physical attacks don't do much. At levels 70 or greater Atma weapon is either so powerful (or just plain ignores) the x/4 penalty of the Offering and can, at high levels, hit 4x for 9999-DMG. Even Ultima + Gem Box is no match for his destructive power. For more fun give him a Genji Glove and another uber sword like Ragnarok, Excalibur, or Scimitar and, well, you get the idea. I hate the stock Illumina though, since it rapes you of your MP to hit harder (and even worse with an Offering). I turn off the MP suckage for it in my hacks on that game.

I prefer not to get into the FF6 talk (not that I don't love it, but that game has been documented to death, and then some). Though, I do recall a bug with MP consuming attacks and putting them in the left hand in a Genji Glove setup... the Illumina failed to critical hit all the time... I'm just trying to debunk how evade is really beneficial to Cid... It's Yang that's much more fragile than Cid is, in relation to magic evade, or lack thereof.
Working on the next Yet To Be Named FF4 "Hardtype" Hack Download Latest: v1.48

Video Demos: #1 #2 #3