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Phoenix

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"Heal/Medicine" Command
« on: February 13, 2008, 05:11:24 PM »
This is the last battle command I intend to test. Using this uses one Potion, and seems to restore between 10 and 20 HP. It will fail if you use it with just one Potion left, but will still consume the Potion. (Don't know if that's the intended behavior or not, but it seems buggy to me. If it was fixed in FF4A it was probably a bug, otherwise it was might have been intended.)

If you have multiple groups of Potions, it starts with the group highest up on your list. However, it will consume two Potions, one from the highest group and one from the second highest. So if you have two groups of one Potion each, it will not only fail, but consume both Potions. Another reason it seems buggy to me.

Does anyone have anything to add to this? Does the HP recovery ever increase in FF4A? (I've never played it, which is why I don't know anything about it.)
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Deathlike2

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2008, 05:18:34 PM »
If you are using a potion, and split it, that's what it is.

Since the command itself isn't powered by level or any particular stat, the effective power is constant. Worse is that the effect is consistant regardless of the number of targets that it successfully hits.

The command is consistant in both SNES and GBA versions.
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Phoenix

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #2 on: February 13, 2008, 05:52:18 PM »
 :bah: Useless...it seems like there's so many useless commands in FF4. They all need to be rebalanced, if we can figure out the data for them. I'll be working on it...
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Deathlike2

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2008, 06:00:26 PM »
Quote from: Phoenix on February 13, 2008, 05:52:18 PM
:bah: Useless...it seems like there's so many useless commands in FF4. They all need to be rebalanced, if we can figure out the data for them. I'll be working on it...

This is one of the rare instances that I would say that those commands being removed for FF2 US wasn't completely a dumb idea. Only Dark Wave needs to be kept.
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Pinkpuff

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2008, 08:35:11 PM »
Split would be cool if he could split any item. Split Phoenix Down, Remedy, or X-Potion would certainly have their uses.
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Dragonsbrethren

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #5 on: February 14, 2008, 03:25:12 PM »
Quote from: Pinkpuff on February 13, 2008, 08:35:11 PM
Split would be cool if he could split any item. Split Phoenix Down, Remedy, or X-Potion would certainly have their uses.

That's what they did in FF4 DS. I still never used it though.
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Deathlike2

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #6 on: February 14, 2008, 09:28:50 PM »
Quote from: Pinkpuff on February 13, 2008, 08:35:11 PM
Split would be cool if he could split any item. Split Phoenix Down, Remedy, or X-Potion would certainly have their uses.

A lot of these uses are outlived by superior solutions.
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JCE3000GT

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2008, 12:27:24 AM »
I always liked the Spirit Wave command that FuSuYa had (regen).  It just wasn't powerful enough.
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Deathlike2

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2008, 02:09:22 AM »
Quote from: JCE3000GT on February 15, 2008, 12:27:24 AM
I always liked the Spirit Wave command that FuSuYa had (regen).  It just wasn't powerful enough.

I think I was more pissed at the "waste" of a command it was... until the GBA version. He's not stuck on doing essentially next to nothing.
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Phoenix

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #9 on: February 15, 2008, 05:54:04 PM »
I think Spirit Wave / Regen was intended to be stronger...or someone really didn't think things through. (80 HP recovery, when you're near the end of the game? I mean, come on.) But, Deathlike2's comment made me think about the GBA version and how it was changed, and I realized I had just found the Battle Command Speed Data (posted in http://slickproductions.org/forum/index.php?topic=290.0). I thought I might be able to change it, but when I looked at it, Regen was a value of 00, so no help there.

However, I was also playing around with the data that comes right after that (it's from A00A8-A01F6) and it had an effect on commands as well, mostly on speed of execution or length of duration. I blanked out the first two lines and Regen was effected, so I guessed and checked until I narrowed it down to the fourth byte (data: 82 81 00 8A). Changing 8A to 00 makes FuSoYa cast Regen only once, and he's able to act on his next turn. It only seems to work once a battle, though, so the second time it doesn't recover anything, but it still only takes one turn.

So, I might be on to something in changing its behavior! I'll keep working on it and let you know.

Edit: I played around with the values, and it seems like 00-81 don't do anything. 82 restores HP once, 83 twice, and so on. However, sometimes two values in a row restore HP the same number of times. Not sure what's affecting that . . . but at least the behavior of Regen is at least a little bit changeable now.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2008, 05:38:35 AM by Phoenix »
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HHIPDragonFox

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2008, 02:38:48 AM »
Quote from: Pinkpuff on February 13, 2008, 08:35:11 PM
Split would be cool if he could split any item. Split Phoenix Down, Remedy, or X-Potion would certainly have their uses.



       20  04  64  02  00  80  = Cure Potion (79934 - headered)
        ^-Member/Party Selectibility & Casting Time. 00-1F time reference: every 00,20,40,60,80,A0,C0,E0.
        ^---00= NonSelectable-Single  -Start on Only one Ally(Caster?), 20= Selectable Ally/Enemy-Single         -Start on Ally,
        ^---40= NonSelectable-Multiple-Start on Only Ally(All),         60= Selectable Ally/Enemy-Single/Mulitple-Start on Ally,
        ^---80= NonSelectable-Single  -Start on Only One Enemy,         A0= Selectable Ally/Enemy-Single         -Start on Enemy,
        ^---C0= NonSelectable-Multiple-Start on Only Enemy,             E0= Selectable Ally/Enemy-Single/Multiple-Start on Enemy.

By changing the 20 to 60 you now can do selectable on  ally/enemy, start on single ally, can do multiple targets.
I believe the Commands work that way too, but I haven't gotten that far yet.
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Deathlike2

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #11 on: February 21, 2008, 03:34:16 PM »
Small Update: This command is not reflectable.
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Deathlike2

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #12 on: February 29, 2008, 05:49:14 PM »
Ok, here's some actual useful info.

Cure1 has a Spell Power of 8. The Base Spell Power that I could derive is also 8, so therefore the healing done by the potion is 64 to 96.

Medicine does split targeting, but ignores the number of targets... so you divide by 5.

Therefore, the healing done to any target is between 12 and 19 (remember to truncate).

Done with the useless command... for now anyways.
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Phoenix

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #13 on: March 13, 2008, 06:55:30 PM »
Figured out a way to make this command less useless: switch the powers of the Potion with the Hi-Potion or X-Potion, or just make the Potion super-powered. You'd have to change all the item drops/steals for the enemies, as well as the shops and chests and things, but it should make Medicine more powerful. A lot of work for one command, but at least it wouldn't be totally useless.

Keep in mind this is theoretical, I haven't tried it at this point.
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Deathlike2

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Re: "Heal/Medicine" Command
« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2008, 07:18:47 PM »
Quote from: Phoenix on March 13, 2008, 06:55:30 PM
Figured out a way to make this command less useless: switch the powers of the Potion with the Hi-Potion or X-Potion, or just make the Potion super-powered. You'd have to change all the item drops/steals for the enemies, as well as the shops and chests and things, but it should make Medicine more powerful. A lot of work for one command, but at least it wouldn't be totally useless.

Keep in mind this is theoretical, I haven't tried it at this point.

Well, the command explicitly uses the item data (I doubt it would simply be fixed). If you look over how the command is interpreted (which will most likely reference the Potion), you can probably swap it with your item of choice or manipulate it to use the item menu and check against items that are strictly single ally targeted and go from there.
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