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Dragonsbrethren

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Boot issues - any ideas?
« on: August 21, 2009, 11:15:46 AM »
First up, some backstory: About two weeks ago (maybe a little more now), I decided to give the Windows 7 RC a try. I had been wanting to do a reformat for a while anyway; I like to do one about once a year even if the computer is still running good, because it always seems to make everything run better. Anyway, since the RC is out there I decided to give that a try, backed up all my important stuff, and wiped my Vista partition. I made two partitions, dividing the drive in half; one for 7, one for another Vista install should I need it. There's also a 10GB recovery partition that I never wiped out, even though I don't plan on ever making use of it, I was afraid that Vista might not install if I did (it's an OEM disc and doesn't prompt for a serial when installing; my guess is it checks for this partition's presence).

Anyway, 7 installed fine, I used it happily for about a week (I still don't see what the big deal is though; it's Vista with a few new features, which are nice features, but given how much people supposedly hated Vista...), then I started running into an issue when booting. Everything would go smoothly until the Starting Windows screen appeared, then the computer would just shut itself off. This happened very rarely, I checked for conflicts with the hardware I had plugged in, and uninstalled a few things I had installed just before it started occuring, but the issue kept happening. 7's built in startup repair supposedly fixed an issue, things went smoothly for about a day or two, then it started happening again. Not only that, it started happening much more frequently; every time I turned my computer on, and occasionally more than once. It got bad enough that I decided to reinstall Vista a few says ago, assuming there was just something about my hardware that 7 didn't like.

Installed Vista and the two service packs, everything seemed to be great, until the next day when I turned the computer on. Same exact issue. This never happened to me before installing 7, so now I've pretty much ruled out hardware incompatibility as the issue (I suppose it could still be an issue with the hardware itself and not the OS, and it's just a coincidence it started acting up shortly after installing 7). I used the recovery console on Vista to rebuild the boot record, but the boot menu was displaying fine and it only turns off after Windows starts loading, so I really don't think it's that. Does anyone have any ideas? I've certainly run out. Right now I'm running off an Ubuntu live CD because I couldn't even get Vista to boot this morning (eight attempts, it's never taken more than three, and even that's rare) and I'm considering installing just to see if this issue also affects a non-Windows OS.

 :edit:

Well, I installed Ubuntu and am able to boot into that just fine. I'll have to give Vista a shot later (7 isn't even displaying in the menu, maybe something really was wrong with it?).

 :edit:

Okay, choosing Vista from GRUB brings me to the standard Windows menu for selecting which OS to boot (which has 7 listed). I've never done an Ubuntu installation with more than one version of Windows installed, so I didn't realize this is how it would work. Anyway, everything seems fine now, I was able to boot into Vista just fine twice now. Hopefully it stays working.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2009, 01:07:27 PM by Dragonsbrethren »

Deathlike2

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2009, 01:28:04 PM »
What hardware are you running?

If you're using an Intel board, you might have issues with their boot disk drivers....
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bond697

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2009, 03:19:03 PM »
when you installed 7 and then vista... each time did you do a full/low level format and install or let the installer do a quick format?  what did you do before you installed ubuntu? maybe something different? letting the installer "quick format" has caused problems for myself and clients before.

as for the vista restore disc, i'm pretty sure it checks your hardware, not so much for that partition.  once it verifies the hardware, there isn't a reason to ask for a serial.

glad to hear it's working, though. :tongue:
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Dragonsbrethren

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #3 on: August 22, 2009, 10:55:03 AM »
What hardware are you running?

If you're using an Intel board, you might have issues with their boot disk drivers....

No, I've got an AMD processor, I believe the board is branded nVidia (it's got one of their onboard graphics chips).

when you installed 7 and then vista... each time did you do a full/low level format and install or let the installer do a quick format?  what did you do before you installed ubuntu? maybe something different? letting the installer "quick format" has caused problems for myself and clients before.

I did the quick format when I installed 7. I didn't realize it didn't do full by default, but had a feeling when it got to installing so fast compared to past  XP installations. I just installed Vista onto a partition I made when I installed 7, so that was also quick formatted. For Ubuntu, that was a full format of the space I gave it.

as for the vista restore disc, i'm pretty sure it checks your hardware, not so much for that partition.  once it verifies the hardware, there isn't a reason to ask for a serial.

Good to hear. I have the serial should I need it, I was just a little worried since it never prompts me for it.

glad to hear it's working, though. :tongue:

Guess what...it stopped working. Ubuntu too, as soon as I select that it just powers off (unlike 7/Vista, which only crap out at the end of the loading stage). Not only that, my DSL modem went, so I'm on dialup again right now. I've got a new modem on the way for free (shame I can't do that with the PC...), and I can't help but think the two might be related. The modem went yesterday afternoon; I unplugged it since we were getting a nasty electric storm, and it wouldn't power on when I plugged it back in later.

Deathlike2

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #4 on: August 22, 2009, 12:57:12 PM »
T-storms have the chance for frying something... so  :sad:
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Dragonsbrethren

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #5 on: August 22, 2009, 01:10:52 PM »
Of course, but I had unplugged everything, so I really don't think it was that. It's just really odd timing that the modem went after the storm; the lights didn't even dim before I unplugged it.

Deathlike2

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #6 on: August 22, 2009, 02:54:46 PM »
Well, if your cable modem is old, it's not a bad time to get a new one anyways.. to use the new protocols... and maybe go faster.
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bond697

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #7 on: August 22, 2009, 05:23:26 PM »
hmm.  if it's all the oses, then it could possibly be the hdd. semi- random acting up like that could be hdd, could be ram, could be mobo.  if you have a drive diagnostic utility for you brand of hdd, i would run it and also memtest86 and maybe some kind of mobo stress test/selftest.

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Dragonsbrethren

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2009, 09:45:53 AM »
I already ran Memtest86 back when the problem started, but I'm running it again just to be sure. I'm not sure about the HDD diagnostic or stress test, I'll have to look into those later.

 :edit:

Memtest86 found no errors. One thing I noticed, after running it I was able to boot into Vista with no problem. I've experienced the same in the past (no problem booting after running Ubuntu off the live CD and installing, no problem after running 7/Vista's repair options), it almost seems like the computer needs to "warm up" before it wants to boot now.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2009, 12:15:52 PM by Dragonsbrethren »

Valerian

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2009, 12:21:15 PM »
You tried removing and reseating your RAM modules to see if that fixes it? Could be dirty contacts and/or chip creep.

Dragonsbrethren

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2009, 01:11:25 PM »
No, I can give that a try later, though.

 :edit:

No errors found with the HDD diagnostic.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2009, 03:17:44 PM by Dragonsbrethren »

Deathlike2

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2009, 04:34:07 PM »
I'm leaning towards PSU/mobo issues... hopefully it's just the PSU.
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bond697

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2009, 05:30:49 PM »
warming up before boot is usually a psu issue, as far as i've seen or read.  i'm in agreement with deathlike.
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Dragonsbrethren

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2009, 06:35:20 AM »
I was actually thinking that too; I've still got the stock PSU and they're pretty notorious for failing. I had always planned on upgrading it, but I figured I'd wait until I could afford to do the full upgrade I wanted to; I guess I shouldn't have. I think I'll get in contact with one of my friends later on, he always has loads of hardware just sitting around. Failing that, I'm not very knowledgeable on the subject, could someone link me to a cheap but good PSU? I don't want to buy something that's going to be as bad as what was in there to begin with (350W should be fine, but if something better than that can be gotten for about the same price, I'd like to, because I do plan on doing some upgrades in the future).

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Re: Boot issues - any ideas?
« Reply #14 on: August 24, 2009, 11:25:10 PM »
Better does not mean higher wattage with PSUs. Trust me on this.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371005 Get this one. I have two, and they run just fine.