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Messages - Deathlike2

2191
Gaming Discussion / Re: FF4 - Magic Analysis
« on: August 05, 2008, 05:17:29 PM »
This is why you need to write a walkthrough for this game, I don't care which version. It would most definitely make a good rival to Djibriel's excellent FF6 walkthrough, at least in terms of bringing forth the best strategies possible.

I've thought about it, but I'm not sure if I actually want to go about doing that. It would probably focus on FF4 anyways, with a few references to FF4ET (FF2 doesn't have that much distinction though).

I don't recall remembering much from any FF3/6 Walkthrough other than the Mynock's (although that walkthrough has a bit of holes in it, but it was solid nonetheless). I'll see what that was about...

If I write one, it would make this game look like a joke, and that's being too kind.

2192
Gaming Discussion / Re: FF4 - Magic Analysis
« on: August 05, 2008, 03:15:33 PM »
Really? The double damage from elemental claws never made much of an impact, I used an ice claw against Rubicante and it didn't seem as good as two non-elemental katanas.

I spent more time throwing Dancing Daggers and Short Katanas away. The bulk of the damage is made for Cecil+Kain anyways.

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I can't see the 4x multiplier making that big of a deal either but I can't really go through the damage formula at the moment, too noisy around here, I can barely focus on typing this post.

It's 4x to the attack power of a character exposing the monster type. Even though the initial attack power appears weak, just multiply that number by 4x and you will see the difference. Heck, I'll give you a reference picture in a moment.

Edit: Here's the pics












2193
Gaming Discussion / Re: FF4 - Magic Analysis
« on: August 05, 2008, 02:41:02 PM »
I take it you mean the thunder claw on Yang, which I definitely use there. If you mean on Edge I can't imagine it working that well, I'd expect the 0 attack power to make the 4x damage bonus negligible compared to using the Masamune and Murasame together.

You should really look at how Edge's attack power is derived from then and the near insta-9999 damage that you're missing out on.

2194
Gaming Discussion / Re: FF4 - Magic Analysis
« on: August 05, 2008, 02:09:37 PM »
Those Fiends in the Land of Summoned Monsters demand for this spell... I fear being Charmed by those monsters... it's worth 6MP. There's alose those TinyToads... and a number of enemies that I can take advantage of before I have access to the anti-mage equipment.

I usually take fiends out with...Bio? Damn, I can't even remember what spell I use on them. :isuck:

Good chance it's Quake or Stone.

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Have you been missing the discussions around this? It does do it, it unfortunately needs to be Reflected off though...

Yeah, but that adds another step, the spell shouldn't be reflectable in the first place. There's one situation where the enemy does the setup for you, EvilMask, and I've yet to try it there since I usually just run from them.

Oh, I totally agree with the reflectable property. However, when did people fear using the Thunder Claw?

2195
Gaming Discussion / Re: FF4 - Magic Analysis
« on: August 05, 2008, 01:36:10 PM »
Level 3 elementals vs...

Well, I've never really liked the elemental summons so these are a good upgrade to the level 2 elementals. Quake might be too powerful, for the same reason as Bio but at least it can be avoided entirely by aerial enemies.

The summons are better than the level 2 elementals, but they cost 2x more MP for only 25% more damage and don't have to worry about split damage. If the summons didn't cost as much, they would have had more usage IMO. You can't fairly compare the level 3 elementals vs the summons.

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Psych/Drain

Definitely need an upgrade to be useful, considering Psych can't even absorb anything in the subterran.

Only 1 monster in the Lunar Core can be taken advantage of...

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Poison

Since it's an attack spell it has the potential to be a good spell, so why did they give it 0 attack power? Doesn't make any sense.

Go figure.

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Sleep

Too unreliable, every time I've needed it it's failed on me.

The Slumber Sword is probably a better option, since Cecil's level tends to be ahead of the pack...

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Stop

The hourglasses are something that looks good on paper, but in practice they don't make any sense. I can see the reasoning, the bronze hourglass is good early in the game but wears off too fast late game, silver works good throughout the game, and gold is great for enemies that take a long time to kill. In practice the bronze hourglass lasts more than long enough for every enemy in the game. Stop itself is one of the few status effect spells I actually make use of.

I actually need to test this vs regular Stop, but if there's an actual difference, perhaps the spell multiplier factors into the timer.. hmmm

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Stone/Break

The one time this shines is in the underground waterway, you can eliminate elecfish for 5 MP less than Bio. That's the only place I've really used it. What I've never understood is why the enemy skill "Beak" exists, isn't it pretty much identical to this?

Beak = 100% hit rate, this isn't 100%.

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Charm

Never really used it.

It's a more reliable Hold/Sleep....

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Silence

Another one I've never really used, I'd rather attack with anti-mage equipment than cast the spell.

Those Fiends in the Land of Summoned Monsters demand for this spell... I fear being Charmed by those monsters... it's worth 6MP. There's alose those TinyToads... and a number of enemies that I can take advantage of before I have access to the anti-mage equipment.

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Dispel

Completely worthless as far as I'm concerned. It can't do the one thing that would truly be useful, removing reflect status.

Have you been missing the discussions around this? It does do it, it unfortunately needs to be Reflected off though...

2196
Gaming Discussion / FF4 - Magic Analysis
« on: August 05, 2008, 01:36:33 AM »
So I was bored...  :lame:  :sleep: I know.. but I might as well give this a go.. especially since noone's given me inspiration for new topics. I might as well digress on some of this stuff (excluding monster magic since the majority are battle/monster specific)... So here we go...


Black Magic

Level 1 elementals and Chocobo

They are fine IMO... but compare this vs the Chocobo spell...

For 40% more MP (which comes to 2MP), you get to deal more damage than exposing an elemental weakness (2x only though) and be more boss-worthy (see Octomammoth).. but Chocobo can't be split (if someone were to hack in a Big Chocobo vision, please do that for my amusement  :wink:)

Level 2 elementals and Bio

They are terrible... especially when you compare against Bio...

For 33% more MP (5MP or so), you can cast an insta-spell that always deals 2x more damage (unless the elemental is exposing an elemental weakness of 2x or more, but that's meh in most cases) plus HP leak (which isn't special, but it's a cool bonus). It's hard to argue the math here.. especially in Palom's case, it's always 6 levels away.

Level 3 elementals vs...

These are spells that are tough to compare.. the closest thing that's comparable is Quake, but Quake is learned a number of levels later, it tends to be a lot more reliable as a split spell.. since the split factor is not in play. The bulk of these become obsolete too quickly, especially when splitting damage is in play. Fortunately the only redemption is being slightly stronger than a elemental summon when there are 3 targets or less. The spells could use a boost though...

Piggy

Too unreliable... the only thing that redeems it is the Change Rod.

Toad

It's Size but much more vicious. One wonders why this is relatively easy to learn for Rydia.. yet Piggy, the inferior status spell is learned much later.. (opposite is true for Palom)...

Warp

I wished Square did keep this as a death spell.. as long as it had a Piggy-like hit rate (very low). It would've worked out IMO. It does take a while to learn this for Rydia (it's like in the upper 10s for her...) I forget how long it takes Palom to learn this...

Psych/Drain

I think FF4ET had the right idea... to buff the spell up to a reasonable base.. but how much? I don't know. Let me put it this way.. it should be possible to drain enough MP to match her maxMP (assuming the target has 0 magic defense).. that's how powerful it "should be"... Drain probably should be 50% to 100% more damage than that, but I'd be weary of overpoweredness. The elemental property though is a useless property but will probably balance out in the end...

Poison

Most irrelevent spell. It currently serves to be the best Monster Summoner patience timer. If the spell were had damage dealt between the level 1 and level 2 elementals, maybe it would have a greater longevity..

Sleep

It's underused for some reason, but that's probably because it's primarily level based and the magic stat limits the sleep time...

Stop

The whole Hourglass thing is kinda strange... as you get a limited number of Silver Ones.. and the Copper Ones are a multitargeted Stop... the Golden Ones are simply rare... anyways I think the spell is fine as is.. I guess

Stone/Break

Shouldn't this cost more MP as a multitargetable insta-kill spell? It puts Cockatrice to shame sometimes...

Weak

Maybe it should have a lower hit rate, but that gets traded to be a multitargetable spell...

Doom/Death

Making this multitargetable should make this a good way of overshadowing Warp... otherwise it's too mediocre a spell.

Flare

This spell is a tad too strong to be insta-hit spell, but then again, it's not a great spell against extremely high magic defense monsters.. I guess it's fine.. but perhaps maybe an MP adjustment would be fair.

Meteor

It takes too long, and it's too depressing. Cut the spell time in half... probably be slightly longer than Bahamut would be the best change for this spell alone.


White Magic

Cure spells

 They are relatively balanced... Cure2/Cura tends to be significantly better than Fire1 (see Tellah when it matters) for Zombie killing.. and Cure3/Curaga is better than Fire2... but that's about it. Also outside healing totally favors Cure1 by design...

Life spells

I guess it's worth what you pay for..

Float

It's useful so it's there

Esuna

My only peeve is that FF4A's version is stupid (removing Berserk)... and HP leak is not removed (why is it added to Dispel of all magic?)

Haste

Not impactful enough... but that's relative to how the ATB works... especially when the 2nd one is very unimpactful. The worst part is that it's not multitargetable...

Slow

Probably too impactful by design... a few variations of this spell may be more beneficial.

Protect/Shell

Relatively non-impactful spells... needs a boost..

Blink

Fine as is, but maybe it needs a 2nd version (a multitargetable version)...

Charm

Fine as is, but could use a second version too (a multitargetable version)

Peep

I wonder if this could be improved to show "extra weakness and drain elementals".. but most importantly.. the level of the enemy...

Sight

It truly needs to do something in battle... either inflicts blind or cure blind (the former sounds better).

Hold

I'm inclined to think there should be a 2nd version of the spell that is multitargetable, but that would be called Sleep...

Silence

Fine as is for what it does.. too bad it's only for preventing regular spells.

Dispel

It doesn't remove enough to be as useful it could be.. and I don't understand why HP Leak is included here... plus monsters don't usually cast Berserk as part of their battle sequence (it's used as a counter primarily)

Reflect

It needs to be multitargetable, but cost more MP for that tradeoff...

Holy

HP Leak is a gimmick considering the target has to be weak vs Holy elemental to take advantage of it. This spell looks awful compared to Flare... needs a spell power boost with a small tweak to spell time...


More spells to digress with later...

2197
Final Fantasy IV Research & Development / Re: DS Version Research
« on: August 03, 2008, 06:51:45 PM »
The HP Boost is most beneficial on Rydia... since it allows the Mist Dragon to be cheap and overpowered.

2198
Slick News / Re: Update at the trade deadline!
« on: August 01, 2008, 09:06:31 PM »
No cable?  :wtf:

2199
Gaming Discussion / Re: FF4 - Top Annoying Monsters
« on: August 01, 2008, 02:34:14 PM »
Yet in all this time, floating doesn't always imply immunity! Not sure if that was corrected or changed, but until someone explains why the CPU should be taking Quake damage, I don't think it's an official change...

2200
Gaming Discussion / Re: FF4 - Top Annoying Monsters
« on: August 01, 2008, 02:15:16 PM »
Frostbeast (IceBeast/Cold Beast) - Some genius decided that these should be able to use Icestorm even when in a group of monsters. Cecil and Cid can overcome it with Cursed Rings and I'm sure it's vulnerable to some status effect but you simply don't have the time to screw around with these things anymore.

Flamehound (FlameDog/Fiery Hound) - See Frostbeast entry, substitute "Icestorm" with "Scorch" and "Cid" with "Kain."

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Goddamn Bats - No, that's not an actual monster name, just a general description, this goes for every goddamn bat in the game, and every version of the game too. These waste way too much time using Bloodfeast, I get so tired of watching that animation over and over...run or stick an Hourglass in whoever will go first's command list to take these out without going insane.

It's the only spare time where you want to release your vengence quickly.

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Bahamut - Okay, there's technically nothing annoying about Bahamut...unless you've played any previous version and go into the battle thinking it'll be the same. You see, they decided it's only fair that his Mega Flare can penetrate the party's Reflect spell just as easily as it does the enemies', so the whole cast Reflect on the party and wait it out strategy is gone. Not only that, he's not one to sit there while you Flare him to death, so he casts Reflect on himself the second you hit him with any spell. On the plus side, at least he doesn't knock the solar system out of alignment when he blasts the party to oblivion with Mega Flare, unlike when you summon him...

Quake doesn't get a second thought? I mean, this is anti-Asura magic.

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Clockwork Dragon (D.Machin/Mach D./Mecha Dragon) - Same reason you pointed out for the previous versions, except they commonly come in groups of two right in front of the damn save point. :clocke:

It's not "out of place", but moreso "it's not a Mech" that annoys the living daylights out of me.


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Lunasaur (D.Lunar) - You only fight one this time (Cue YouTube idiot: "they made it easier!!!11") but what a fight. It uses Bad Breath on the entire party three or four times in a row, then uses physicals and Bio for a while, before returning to Bad Breath and repeating the whole thing. Basically, make sure you have some status protection on and that Rosa has Omnicasting so you can cure everyone really fast. I do like that they made the monster guarding the Ribbons a massive status effect abuser though.

It's simply strange that Breath is used late in its original script.. to justify the existance of the Ribbons..

2201
Gaming Discussion / Re: Final Fantasy VI Prototype Screenshots
« on: August 01, 2008, 02:05:53 PM »
I plead total ignorance to that PSX port of the game, so  :isuck:

2202
Slick News / Re: Update at the trade deadline!
« on: August 01, 2008, 01:27:57 PM »
I thought the Braves+TBS had a special contract..
They did, last year was the last year of that deal. Now they can broadcast any games they want.

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I'm fully aware of their "Sunday afternoon game of the week", which is part of their agreement with MLB.. which includes the playoffs, and unfortunately the ALCS (I don't want to fucking watch the NL playoffs on my end, damn you MLB and FOX).
Be thankful your FOX reception is viewable, since we have a nice mountain blocking a good portion of the channels for us. Everything is very snowy and FOX is especially bad. Not ironically enough, the reception is many times better when it's a cloudy day.

I don't get TBS here (mostly because of our cable package), so the term "I can't see it at all" is my gripe. Fortunately the local FOX affliate has been perfect as far as I'm concerned (other than the occasion goofups on location that happen).

2203
Slick News / Re: Update at the trade deadline!
« on: August 01, 2008, 01:19:45 PM »
Doesn't TBS still do Braves games? Lots of hopelessness there after trading away Texiera and their season.
Only if they are the "Game of the week." TBS is only sticking to showing the big market games right now (a ton of Yankees, Red Sox, and Mets games). In fact, I'm not sure if they haven't done a game without those teams yet... :banonsmash:

I thought the Braves+TBS had a special contract..

I'm fully aware of their "Sunday afternoon game of the week", which is part of their agreement with MLB.. which includes the playoffs, and unfortunately the ALCS (I don't want to fucking watch the NL playoffs on my end, damn you MLB and FOX).

2204
Slick News / Re: Update at the trade deadline!
« on: August 01, 2008, 12:51:51 PM »
Doesn't TBS still do Braves games? Lots of hopelessness there after trading away Texiera and their season.

2205
Gaming Discussion / Re: Final Fantasy VI Prototype Screenshots
« on: August 01, 2008, 12:49:29 PM »
The only thing I see different is the monster count.. but I'm not sure if that's normal in the PSX version.