øAslickproductions.org/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=5f0fck550j2m4m2fpbtkj2vkm1&topic=2041.msg23277e:/My Web Sites/Slick Productions - FFIV Message Board/slickproductions.org/forum/indexc529.htmlslickproductions.org/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=5f0fck550j2m4m2fpbtkj2vkm1&topic=2041.60e:/My Web Sites/Slick Productions - FFIV Message Board/slickproductions.org/forum/indexc529.html.zx„g^ÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÈ…¬DOKtext/htmlISO-8859-1gzip@øÕDÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿTue, 10 Mar 2020 04:53:46 GMT0ó°° ®0®P®€§²ð®ƒg^ÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿy8D Final battle freezes everyone / Grimoire LD plays Unprecedented Crisis

Author Topic: Final battle freezes everyone / Grimoire LD plays Unprecedented Crisis  (Read 16731 times)

Grimoire LD

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You've really changed up Plague, it is a surprisingly intense battle trying to keep everyone from being petrified and constantly using Remedy. He seemed weak to Ice, which was interesting. Wow! The Hades Helm gives Cecil, crazy defense! It does kill his magic defense though, compared to the Headband.

The Lunar Dragons take a Beating from the Apollo Harp! 6000 damage! Very impressive.

Their Reflect does eventually run out of steam though and they keep casting Ice-3 on themselves.

Then when one of them dies, the other doesn't do anything

Oh, the event itself gives the item now. Neat.

Unfortunately if I want Cecil to have x8 Attack Multipliers I can't give up the Gauntlet slot.

Did not expect the Ribbons to still be there actually...

Whoa! Was not expecting the Ribbons to give a +5 Stat Boost to All Stats!

...Did I just get super lucky? I just fought the Kary/Warlock encounter from a chest and got two items. One is the Masamune, which I already have, and the other is the Ninja suit... which I already have.

Oh well, it means that Porom can have another Attack Multiplier for the front row!

At Level 41 Tellah finally has enough MP to cast Meteo!

Um... from a Chest Behemoth Battle I just got 10 Artemis Bows. I take it a slight mix up in ranges?

You dealt with the Wyvern in a really smart way, even including a counter to Dispel! Very impressive work. My strategy was to Berserk Edward and Cecil and let those two have at him, while I kept the Reflect down with Dispel, despite the slight healing he was doing for himself. It was a rather intense fight, and again it shows your strength in building timing based battles.

And the Deathbringer sword is mine!

Wow!! Cecil's stats have skyrocketed! 15 to all stats, except for Will, this surprisingly boosts his Wisdom high enough that he has x2 Magic Defense multipliers!

Holy Spear from Chest, reasonable enough.

The Lord's Robe increases Wisdom and Will by 15 Each? That's a really great item!

Alright! Porom learned Arise!

And what's this? The Fiery Hammer?

It... provides no bonuses, probably Fire Elemental and judging from what you described of Thor's Hammer will fail to cast Ifrit. Granted a Fire Elemental Hammer does have its perks...

Or not! Wow! It casts Flare! As in Flare Sledgehammer, dealing 4000+ damage on use! Porom just became de facto damage dealer alongside Edward (now there's two things I thought I'd never say)

Oh awesome! The Loki Harp!

Looks like it still has x4 damage against all enemy types, awesome!

The Mirage Robe is a nice upgrade for Edward.

Rune Axe, nice to keep in mind for Kain and Cid.

Now the dungeon up until the savepoint has been fully looted! It is time to finish this!

Porom learned Holy at 55! Better late, than never.

EvilMask's are jokes with Dispel! (The same applied to the DS version as well)

Level 58 Palom learns Flare! Alright!

Yet another Ribbon in the Lunar Subterrane! Normally this is a Fuma Shuriken as I recall.

Ogopogo was pretty simple. Not really much more to add than that.

A Berserked Porom dealt 9999 damage to an EvilMask and it was Glorious!!

Another Mirage Robe? Hmm, alright.

More Robe of Lords, fantastic!

Strength Gloves! Now that's pretty fantastic! While it does shoot Porom's speed, it does give her more attack multipliers!

I like the savepoint right before the final floors, it was good idea in EasyType, a good idea in Project II and it's a fine idea here.

Well, I think it's pretty easy to see what spell Harm replaced, as it is all Breath does instead of Scan.

And here I am in front of Zemus...

Dark Knight Cecil - Level 54
Tellah - Level 47
Palom - Level 59
Porom - Level 56
Edward - Level 59

Let's give it a go!

And Yang's sprite is standing where Cecil ends up, an NPC visibility mix up?

Oh that is neat! Because my Cecil is still a Dark Knight the "man of Darkness" plot point is passed onto him! That makes a lot of sense!

...I am then warped to the Lunar Whale. Which means something must have went terribly, terribly wrong.

...does this have something to do with the entire party being dead? If so I can do a quick check into the event and change it so that at least Cecil is alive when the next "IF" flag is checked.



Pinkpuff

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I thought I fixed the 10 bow thing... I'll look into it tonight.

Yang shouldn't be there and he wasn't for me, but that might have to do with the fact that I picked him up whereas you skipped him. I'll look into it.

The Lunar Whale thing is what I was panicking about a few posts ago. I'll fix it tonight and upload.

Since you've basically seen more or less what I have done of the game, or what you could in a single pass, what is your overall take on it?
Let's dance!

Grimoire LD

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I thought I fixed the 10 bow thing... I'll look into it tonight.

Yang shouldn't be there and he wasn't for me, but that might have to do with the fact that I picked him up whereas you skipped him. I'll look into it.

The Lunar Whale thing is what I was panicking about a few posts ago. I'll fix it tonight and upload.

Since you've basically seen more or less what I have done of the game, or what you could in a single pass, what is your overall take on it?

All in all I loved it! It was a neat take on the classic plot of FFIV and for the most part you used the basic tools of the very game itself (one or two ASM hacks not withstanding) to show that the original system still has its merits! I am surprised the Shadow Mod was not included though, I take it the project was just a little too far along to make good use of it at the time? If such were done you wouldn't have these almost odd "Don't embark on saving the King of Fabul if you don't want Yang on your team!" It's just a little strange, I will admit.

There's also a little bit of oddity in the story setup. Especially when you have Tellah in the party, I can't see him just going along with Cecil's naive "Go and ask the Elder for forgiveness" line after you've defeated Golbez. That part rang just a little bit strange, considering how dogged Golbez has been on the part in this version and his "I was being controlled!" quip may not convince some of the more hardliners in the party like Cid, Tellah, Kain, or even this version's Rosa. Zeromus also seems a little bit more out of nowhere than he did in the original, but I don't know of a way to fix that part.

Aside from that though I loved the changes to the story and they all worked out very well and despite being a veteran of FFIV I didn't know where the story was headed next and it kept me on my toes all throughout!

Now, I am curious to know how many spare maps you have left, because I really like the party choice, but the issue I find with it is that this party is only around for 3 or 4 dungeons. I was wondering if you may want to add an additional area before the final floors of the Lunar Subterrane, perhaps the "Zemus Zone" that seemed to be planned for the original? I'm thinking something along the lines of FFV's "Void" that had a large collection of different settings before you emerged in the end, this way it gives the final party choice that little extra "oomph!" which will really make the party acquiring dynamic stand out.

I have noticed that FuSoYa is nowhere to be seen. Does this mean that you're planning for a new party member somewhere down the line?

Another thing I really enjoyed was how the five treasures in the Lunar Subterrane were the Dark Knight's best equipment. Though I'm surprised you went with the names of the Level 2 Armor, instead of the Level 3 Demon Armor? In addition the Hades Shield kind of pales in comparison to the Dragon Shield, as far as I can make out, to the Dragon Shield, it only gives one or two more defense, the 5 Wisdom, but doesn't have the Elemental Resistances or Dragon Resistances which is Imperative at this late stage.


Pinkpuff

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The shadow mod was a self-imposed limitation. It's obvious the fun you can have if you hack the game to be able to remember everyone's stats, but I wanted to demonstrate that you can still make a great hack without it, and even one that lets you pick your final party!

I love the idea of an extended final dungeon. More chance to level your chosen team without feeling like grinding. I have lots of unused maps but I'm not sure how much  map space I have.
Let's dance!

Grimoire LD

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The shadow mod was a self-imposed limitation. It's obvious the fun you can have if you hack the game to be able to remember everyone's stats, but I wanted to demonstrate that you can still make a great hack without it, and even one that lets you pick your final party!

I love the idea of an extended final dungeon. More chance to level your chosen team without feeling like grinding. I have lots of unused maps but I'm not sure how much  map space I have.

I agree, you did an amazing job with sticking to mostly already programmed setups and that you set up a final party without a Shadow Mod is also rather special!

Ah, Map Space... well. that should be able to be told from looking where your last actual map is and counting down from there, that would be a neat little addition to the editor to know how much map space is left or even how much space each map takes.

chillyfeez

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If I'm not mistaken, FF4kster does tell you how much map space is left, no?

Pinkpuff

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http://timecave.net/ff4kster/crisis/Unprecedented%20Crisis%200.6%20Alpha.zip

I forgot to mention, I got rid of FuSoYa completely; he serves no purpose now that Tellah survives, and felt a little tacked on, even in the original. I also needed actors ^_^;

Anyway, yes FF4kster tells you how much map space is left in the map editor ("Room"; though now that I think about it that could be an ambiguous label). What I was getting at with my comment though was more the fact that map space is the more relevant resource for me than number of free maps. I may also run into space limitations with triggers. I've already had to hijack a couple of overworld ones to get the serpent road working.

Anyway the above patch won't fix Yang but it should fix the rest of the stuff, including undummying what I have done of the ending. It will stop abruptly during the Baron throne room sequence, so that's not a bug that's just me not having it finished yet. I got some good plans. Also there will be more leading up to it that I still haven't written.
Let's dance!

elvind

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Long time lurker, first time poster.

Been playing through your hack and absolutely love it! I just got Palom and Porom.

I really, really like that it's taking awhile to get the airship, and that you're required to use the black chocobo for more than just the magnetic cave.

Love that Edward is actually useful. He made my final team in FF4A and TAY (yay Android remake! Sure, they just reused the FF4 engine, but hey, it's FF4!). He and Golbez are my two favorite characters. I can't wait to get him back! (I read through Grimoire's let's play and got very excited to play it, so I've got an idea of what's coming up next).

I chuckled at the Captain Planet reference.

Gave me the drive to make a hack that won't end up as a spoof! ... we'll see how long those good intentions last.

Anyway, thanks to you and everyone for ff4kster and the awesome hack!

Grimoire LD

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http://timecave.net/ff4kster/crisis/Unprecedented%20Crisis%200.6%20Alpha.zip

I forgot to mention, I got rid of FuSoYa completely; he serves no purpose now that Tellah survives, and felt a little tacked on, even in the original. I also needed actors ^_^;

Anyway, yes FF4kster tells you how much map space is left in the map editor ("Room"; though now that I think about it that could be an ambiguous label). What I was getting at with my comment though was more the fact that map space is the more relevant resource for me than number of free maps. I may also run into space limitations with triggers. I've already had to hijack a couple of overworld ones to get the serpent road working.

Anyway the above patch won't fix Yang but it should fix the rest of the stuff, including undummying what I have done of the ending. It will stop abruptly during the Baron throne room sequence, so that's not a bug that's just me not having it finished yet. I got some good plans. Also there will be more leading up to it that I still haven't written.
So that's what "Room" is. I thought it was some sort of incomplete feature that told the user what room number they were currently editing (which would be a bit redundant because of the numerical index) nice touch!

Triggers are fairly tricky, Event Triggers can be a bit of trouble all in all, there is a bit of free space for them though which I don't think the editor can utilize at the moment that could easily let you add more in. Normal triggers shouldn't be too much of an issue, especially since these would be Underworld Maps so space for them should be rather abundant.

That's reasonable, though don't forget the only thing special about Golbez and Anna's actors are what they link to. They can be easily assigned normal character's levels, commands, and the like, at least to my knowledge. Maybe you know a bit more about that then I do.

Back to the game, looking forward to seeing the (half-complete) ending!

Ah! So Golbez becomes a Paladin instead, going to Mt. Ordeals to take Cecil's place. That makes a great deal of sense! When I was testing I knew Golbez appeared, but didn't read anything past that.

Big Bang did not seem that powerful. Only dealing 200 damage to Tellah, and 900 to Cecil, shockingly.

Oh. Oh that second one did a number on me.

He was a little tricky, but wasn't that difficult to take out. Flare couldn't outright kill any character at full HP and with 31 Elixirs lined up I could throw them around like candy.

I love Zeromus' new closing lines, a lot more powerful than the basic "as long as there is evil..." and stopping there. Here he expresses what he means and it has much more impact.

Your idea for Zeromus makes a little more sense than FFIV's... what was Zeromus in the normal FFIV anyhow? Was he Zemus' spirit? A completely different entity of hate? I mean, it's just so strange. Yours it is made clear was a dark being that made a pact with Golbez but eventually corrupted Golbez's heart and the methods of his revival correspond to things that have been talked about in the game.

Tellah's line is fantastic, and also "obsession" is spelled wrong there. I think the game believes that the Yang Event Flag is triggered since he said his line as well.

Strangely enough though, Golbez did not appear. The sprite of the Paladin I mean. I know he had done so in my original testing.

From what you've completed of the ending, it is wonderful. You can see the decisions that were made taking effect (at least I'm assuming so that Kain wouldn't be with Bahamut in the ending had he not been left with Bahamut) and all the damage that Golbez had wrought was being undone. One small little glitch though when Edward and Tellah are leaving the throne room, Tellah is still in his waving animation instead of his walking animation. Also the idea to make Titan's sprite into a recolored Fabul Fighter was brilliant!

Well it's been a really fun ride and as you can guess I will look forward to completing it again when the ending is finished and then I'll start a run where Cecil becomes a Paladin with a completely different party.

Now for some suggestions...

Golbez's 180 turn comes across as him being very desperate. He had been defeated completely, but before then we don't know why he has chosen this path or caused all of this damage, or in the end why he would choose to truthfully repent. Judging from the ending it seemed he had good intentions that were subverted in some way. Were there any thoughts to address this deeper backstory for Golbez, since he wasn't just evil for evil's sake or brain-washed this time around?


Long time lurker, first time poster.

Been playing through your hack and absolutely love it! I just got Palom and Porom.

I really, really like that it's taking awhile to get the airship, and that you're required to use the black chocobo for more than just the magnetic cave.

Love that Edward is actually useful. He made my final team in FF4A and TAY (yay Android remake! Sure, they just reused the FF4 engine, but hey, it's FF4!). He and Golbez are my two favorite characters. I can't wait to get him back! (I read through Grimoire's let's play and got very excited to play it, so I've got an idea of what's coming up next).

I chuckled at the Captain Planet reference.

Gave me the drive to make a hack that won't end up as a spoof! ... we'll see how long those good intentions last.

Anyway, thanks to you and everyone for ff4kster and the awesome hack!

Welcome Elvind! Yes this is a tour de force of FFIV modification from start to end and it started out as an exhibition of the editor and has succeeded in that by ten fold!

You are in quite a transitiony part of the mod. Where things can get really difficult, really fast, if you're not adequately prepared.

I am looking forward to seeing more of your reactions as well and if you have any questions about the mod, or FFIV hacking, feel free to ask and we'll do our best to answer!


Pinkpuff

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I tried to explain in the dialogue but maybe it doesn't come across... basically Golbez was just really power hungry. He clung to it to the bitter end and only when he was completely and utterly defeated did he realize what he had done.

Zeromus wasn't controlling Golbez; more like Golbez's greed and everyone else's hatred for him and thirst for revenge gave form to Zeromus.
Let's dance!

Grimoire LD

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I tried to explain in the dialogue but maybe it doesn't come across... basically Golbez was just really power hungry. He clung to it to the bitter end and only when he was completely and utterly defeated did he realize what he had done.

Zeromus wasn't controlling Golbez; more like Golbez's greed and everyone else's hatred for him and thirst for revenge gave form to Zeromus.

I did understand that part, I was under the impression that Golbez received power from Zeromus and felt obliged to do his bidding, my mistake. Alright so Zeromus didn't bestow any powers upon Golbez, just the hate that people bore for Golbez and Golbez's own destructive measures drew Zeromus into existence.

That's all well and good, but what was Golbez's end goal? Was it to rule the land? If so, why would he want to? What would make him think that he was a better caretaker of the world than the rest of the nations? You've noted that he repents what he has done after he is utterly defeated which means there must have been a spark of good to turn into a flame as such which leads me to think the old adage of "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" may apply here. You did mention something about Fabul in that is where Ricard died, hinting that Odin and his countrymen fought *something* else sometime ago and if that was another kingdom it may stand to reason that Golbez saw a cycle of repeating war unless something was done?


Pinkpuff

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I think those kind of questions are beyond the scope of what I'm going for in this hack. The past is deliberately only vaguely hinted at; the player is free to fill in the details with their own head canon. As for Golbez, who says he needs a specific end goal? He craves power and does what it takes to feed the craving. It could very well be that had he won he could have just been like, "hm, what now..." For him the power is the goal.
Let's dance!

Grimoire LD

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I think those kind of questions are beyond the scope of what I'm going for in this hack. The past is deliberately only vaguely hinted at; the player is free to fill in the details with their own head canon. As for Golbez, who says he needs a specific end goal? He craves power and does what it takes to feed the craving. It could very well be that had he won he could have just been like, "hm, what now..." For him the power is the goal.

A good point, this is based on the SNES version after all which purposely seemed to trim character's backstories here and there. That's fine then.

vivify93

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Unprecedented Crisis? Interesting name, I remember using the phrase in one of my NPC dialogues in Project II. Did the title come from that at all, or is it just coincidence? :p
Hacking is hard. :sad:

Pinkpuff

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I'm embarrassed to say, I have yet to check out Project II. The phrase comes from the original translation. The king of Fabul says it right before you depart on the boat.
Let's dance!