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Author Topic: FF6 Improvement Project  (Read 278338 times)

Poco Loco

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #105 on: October 15, 2009, 11:25:24 PM »
I think wall in place of rfect is good

personally I think Lost would be a good replacement for Lore, that's just me

I mean sure he is using special lost magic after all, Lore just kinda sounds like an ancient kind relic or something that's just me lol

or you can just put Red for Red Magic, the reason why I am not suggesting Blue Magic or Blue is because that would be a good replacement for Rage
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"Sometimes ninjas do wrong to each other, and in dat way the force of tha earf' comes around da moon - and at that presence, da dirt, it overshadows the grass, so you're like, I can't cut dis grass, there's no sun comin' through. So in order to enable each other the two fruits have to look each other in da eye and understand we can only be right, as da ripe is wrong, you know what I mean?"

-HNIC

vivify93

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #106 on: October 16, 2009, 01:50:22 AM »
Rage's original name was a Japanese verb meaning "to go into a fury". It had nothing to do with Blue Magic at all.

Strago's special skill was called "memorized technique", essentially. It has nothing to do with lost spells or the Red Mage. "Lore" is probably short for "Lore Skills", as in "a skill passed down since antiquity". Doesn't have the same connotations as "memorized technique" or even "blue magic", but it's a lot less clunky compared to other options.
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darkmage

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #107 on: October 16, 2009, 01:54:22 PM »
Quote from: vivify93 on October 16, 2009, 01:50:22 AM
Rage's original name was a Japanese verb meaning "to go into a fury". It had nothing to do with Blue Magic at all.

Strago's special skill was called "memorized technique", essentially. It has nothing to do with lost spells or the Red Mage. "Lore" is probably short for "Lore Skills", as in "a skill passed down since antiquity". Doesn't have the same connotations as "memorized technique" or even "blue magic", but it's a lot less clunky compared to other options.

Agreed. Given space constraints and what his skill actually does, Lore is probably the best fit. After all, he's studying the monster's techniques to find something he can use, and that's similar to the reason someone would study historical/ancient/etc lore.

Quote from: vivify93 on October 15, 2009, 02:32:26 PM
I dunno, personally I'd prefer that you try to use spell names that fit, rather than truncations, hence the suggestions.

Note that here I'm not considering something like "CaitSith" a truncation, 'cause aside from the missing space, it's not really a truncation...

Ehh...yeah, I agree with you normally, and it chafes me to have to truncate words. But I'm also looking for a term that best fits what the spell/skill/technique does, and sometimes I'll have to make a choice I don't fully agree with based on the above-mentioned space constraints.

That being said, I've got a question: Is there any place where the "X Fight" command is listed in the hex? I've been looking for it and I see "X Magic", so I'm wondering if this command is handled differently than the rest...?
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vivify93

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #108 on: October 16, 2009, 03:47:28 PM »
EDIT: I get the feeling I'm missing a point. Never mind.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2009, 04:26:36 PM by vivify93 »
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Dragonsbrethren

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #109 on: October 17, 2009, 07:29:39 AM »
Quote from: darkmage on October 16, 2009, 01:54:22 PM
That being said, I've got a question: Is there any place where the "X Fight" command is listed in the hex? I've been looking for it and I see "X Magic", so I'm wondering if this command is handled differently than the rest...?

There's no such thing as "X-Fight." The name is used in the Offering's description, but the command name never actually changes.
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darkmage

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #110 on: October 21, 2009, 07:59:21 PM »
OK, a list of things I've done since the last update, most of which involves putting things back to the original Japanese:

  • Changed the Esper summon technique names where possible (i.e., Maduin's "Chaos Wing" to "Chaos Wave")
  • Changed the command "Fight" to "Attack"
  • Changed the command "Slot" to "Slots" and "GP Rain" to "GP Toss" - also updated the Coin Toss accessory description
  • Changed "Rflect" to "Wall" and updated relevant descriptions and dialogue
  • Changed "Safe" to "Shield" and updated relevant descriptions and dialogue
  • Changed "Scan" to "Libra"
  • Changed "Vanish" to "Fade"
  • Changed "Demi" to "Grav"
  • Changed "Quartr" to "Grav 2" and updated Gravity Rod description
  • Changed "W Wind" to "Cyclon" - best I could do, and it kinda fits with Merton, which I kept
  • Changed Magitek ability "X-Fer" to "Banish"
  • Changed the Cafe signs back to Pub, and updated all relevant dialogue
  • Changed key item Cider to Sake and updated all relevant dialogue

Yeah, I thought I was done until I started seeing the actual differences between the Japanese FF6 and the English. Oh well...hopefully when I'm done, this'll be something people find much better than the original English release...which is the whole point.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2009, 08:06:59 PM by darkmage »
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vivify93

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #111 on: October 21, 2009, 09:50:43 PM »
Scan to Libra? Vanish to Fade? W Wind to Cyclon? Sure, why not. I can always change those if I don't like them. I've accepted that.

Cider to sake? That's crossing the line. I really wish I were Ryusui right now. He could explain this better. But sake is a catch-all for any type of liquor in Japan, apparently. Come up with a type of liquor for the old boozehound to drink; don't just cheap out by using the original term.

Rum, vodka, gin, moonshine, wine, some other type of booze I don't know because lol16, or just leave it to our imaginations like the Japanese version did and call it "liquor".
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Poco Loco

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #112 on: October 22, 2009, 02:30:39 AM »
I agree with vivify on the whole liquor thing

but honestly I luv the changes u made there :)

here is a suggestion if u want

change item to use

just throwing 1 out there :p
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"Sometimes ninjas do wrong to each other, and in dat way the force of tha earf' comes around da moon - and at that presence, da dirt, it overshadows the grass, so you're like, I can't cut dis grass, there's no sun comin' through. So in order to enable each other the two fruits have to look each other in da eye and understand we can only be right, as da ripe is wrong, you know what I mean?"

-HNIC

vivify93

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #113 on: October 22, 2009, 04:17:19 AM »
I like the changes generally as well. I apologize for only outlining what I belive to be the negative, but I feel that it's a little more constructive as compared to going "GOOD LUCK! I LOVE YOU ALL!".

As for the "Item" to "Use" thing, that might've made more sense if he were hacking FFI, where the "Item" command is actually the "Use Equipment's Innate Skill" command, but here it's just the "Use Items" command. When restricted, it makes a little more sense to tell the player the "Items" part of that than the "Use" part of that, doesn't it?

 :edit:
New suggestion for the "Bersk" spell.

"Bersrk".
« Last Edit: October 22, 2009, 04:46:40 AM by vivify93 »
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darkmage

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #114 on: October 22, 2009, 04:56:13 AM »
Quote from: vivify93 on October 21, 2009, 09:50:43 PM
Cider to sake? That's crossing the line. I really wish I were Ryusui right now. He could explain this better. But sake is a catch-all for any type of liquor in Japan, apparently. Come up with a type of liquor for the old boozehound to drink; don't just cheap out by using the original term.

Rum, vodka, gin, moonshine, wine, some other type of booze I don't know because lol16, or just leave it to our imaginations like the Japanese version did and call it "liquor".

LOL! This from the guy who got me making all these extra changes by pointing out the Lina Darkstar translation!  :happy:

Seriously, though, this is the kind of thing I like to hear about. The last thing I want to do is make a patch no one but me will play. I can definitely change that...in fact, my first draft of the script overhaul had him going on and on about drinking without specifying any kind of alcohol at all.

But let me ask: you seem to have an issue with the changes I'm making with regard to the spells and such, but short of expanding the spell name lengths (which I haven't quite dared to take on), I'm doing what I can. My rationale is to make the names legible and consistent with either 1) the FF3us naming or 2) the overall FF naming conventions, whichever looks the best or makes the most sense. I'd like to know your thoughts on naming spells and items.

For example, my current working name for "Bserk" is "Brserk". I'm not quite happy with it, so I'm open to more suggestions.
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vivify93

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #115 on: October 22, 2009, 07:59:17 AM »
Sure thing.

Alrighty, first of all is the 2/3 conventions. No, no, this isn't going to be an argument for "ra/ga", this is an argument of consistency. The Life spells, the Cure spells, the Slow spells, and the elemental spells all use the convention of "<Spell> 2". However, that causes a discrepancy with the two Haste spells. Since we're only alotted six letters, and "Haste" is five, we get "Haste2". What I would recommend is squishing the number to each spell, so we get a nice, consistent "<Spell>2" (i.e. Cure2, Fire3, Life3, etc.)

Nextly is the spell Merton. ...That's fine as-is, but this is just a reminder that Emperor Gestahl casts "Melton" on the Floating Continent, which is obviously a discrepancy.

Then we have the spell "Remedy". FFII for the FamiCom's translation called it "Heal", as did FFIII. FFIV called it "Esuna" I believe. FFV called it "Esna", "Heal", then "Esuna". Since the item is called "Remedy", I recommend calling it something else.

"Doom" and "Pearl" should become "Death" and "Holy", as their current names are for censorship reasons.

"Demi" and "Quartr" are fine as "Grav", but I'd call the second spell "Grav2", personally.

W Wind was called "WWind" on FFIII's fan translation, "Tornado" in other iterations, and "Weak" in FFII SNES. I suggested "Gale". "Storm" works as well, though that's already an attack name... Nothing else really works...

But, for your saying "Gale" doesn't sound strong...
"1. a very strong wind.
2. Meteorology. a wind of 32–63 mph (14–28 m/sec).
3. a noisy outburst: 'a gale of laughter filled the room.'  
4. ARCHAIC. a gentle breeze."

And I doubt anyone is going to use the archaic definition.

A spell similar to "Rasp" was called "Anti", "Faze", and "Sap" in various translations of FFII, for your reference.

As for "Berserk", while I initially suggested "Enrage", I actually recommend "Fury", now. Unless you don't like that that's the name for a status ailment in FFVII.

I recommend leaving the spell "Scan"; that's what it was called in the 90's.

"Vanish" is a blue magic spell, which essentially has the same effect, for Quina in FFIX. That's why I'd leave it.

"Warp" is actually more similar to "Exit" in FFI-V. Not recommending that change, just throwin' it out there.

And while we're on the subject, "Pearl Wind" should be "White Wind".

 :edit:
Ah, you mentioned items too. Well, the only thing I suggest is to spell out "Shield" and "Brush" where you can, use "Mythril" instead of "Mithril", and try to space out names were possible.
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darkmage

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #116 on: October 22, 2009, 10:06:16 AM »
Quote
first of all is the 2/3 conventions. No, no, this isn't going to be an argument for "ra/ga", this is an argument of consistency. The Life spells, the Cure spells, the Slow spells, and the elemental spells all use the convention of "<Spell> 2". However, that causes a discrepancy with the two Haste spells. Since we're only alotted six letters, and "Haste" is five, we get "Haste2". What I would recommend is squishing the number to each spell, so we get a nice, consistent "<Spell>2" (i.e. Cure2, Fire3, Life3, etc.)

OK, that's reasonable. I was looking at that yesterday, trying to see what I could do about that. I thought about changing "Haste" to "Fast", but I don't want to go all the way back to FF1 to justify that. So that's doable.

Quote
Nextly is the spell Merton. ...That's fine as-is, but this is just a reminder that Emperor Gestahl casts "Melton" on the Floating Continent, which is obviously a discrepancy.

Actually, according to the English, he does cast Merton in the scene with the Statues. No discrepency there.

Quote
Then we have the spell "Remedy". FFII for the FamiCom's translation called it "Heal", as did FFIII. FFIV called it "Esuna" I believe. FFV called it "Esna", "Heal", then "Esuna". Since the item is called "Remedy", I recommend calling it something else.

Already changed to Esuna. I could change the item to Panacea like the Japanese, but I'm OK with the name as is.

Quote
"Doom" and "Pearl" should become "Death" and "Holy", as their current names are for censorship reasons.

Pearl is Holy already, per everyone's suggestion. Doom...I actually kinda like the way it sounds...more poetic, if you can get behind that.

Quote
W Wind was called "WWind" on FFIII's fan translation, "Tornado" in other iterations, and "Weak" in FFII SNES. I suggested "Gale". "Storm" works as well, though that's already an attack name... Nothing else really works...

The reason I couldn't leave it as "W Wind" is because the Lore "Pearl Wind" was changed to"White Wind", same as FFV. I actually had changed it to "Storm" before I found the enemy attack (dammit!) "Cyclon" seemed reasonable, given that it's one of the most powerful spells, and that I was leaving Merton  as is. "Gale" fits technically, but Cyclon or Tornado would be more appropriate, since the spell animation is similar (if not the same) for the Cyclonic enemy attack.

:edit:
Fixed. Changed the enemy attack to Gale, and the spell to Storm.  :omghax:

Quote
A spell similar to "Rasp" was called "Anti", "Faze", and "Sap" in various translations of FFII, for your reference.

I'm actually more concerned with "Osmose" than "Rasp". The Japanese show these two spells as Raspil and Aspil, but that sounds dumb. I'll have to look at both of those.

:edit:
Currently going with FFIVus and the "Psych" spell, until I hear something better. I suppose "Osmose" can stay for now. I looked up and down the magic lists for the various FF games, and what came closest to the Rasp concept is the blue magic "Magic Hammer", which hurts my head trying to fit that in 6 letters or less...

Quote
As for "Berserk", while I initially suggested "Enrage", I actually recommend "Fury", now. Unless you don't like that that's the name for a status ailment in FFVII.

"Fury" could work. I also thought of "Zerk", like the Telstar attack "Megazerk", but that's more funny than something I'd actually use.

:edit:
Bah. "Madden" would be perfect if it wasn't for the football guy John...

Quote
I recommend leaving the spell "Scan"; that's what it was called in the 90's.

I'm not attached to Libra as the spell name, and since I'm not going strictly by the Japanese anyway...done.

Quote
"Vanish" is a blue magic spell, which essentially has the same effect, for Quina in FFIX. That's why I'd leave it.

That was actually me trying to find a better name for the "X-Zone" spell. The one that immediately came to mind was Banish, and I didn't want to have two different spells sounding almost exactly alike. But I ended up using Banish in place of Terra's Magitek "X-Fer" skill, so I can probably change that back. I kinda like Fade, but again, not attached to it.

:edit:
Fixed. Fade back to Vanish, and X-Zone changed to FFVII's Remove. Subtle, but accurate.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2009, 01:35:45 PM by darkmage »
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Poco Loco

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #117 on: October 22, 2009, 02:46:41 PM »
I like these man :)

I was thinking, just a small tweak its up 2 u all

x-zone can be changed to void

but hey its just a suggestion :p
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"Sometimes ninjas do wrong to each other, and in dat way the force of tha earf' comes around da moon - and at that presence, da dirt, it overshadows the grass, so you're like, I can't cut dis grass, there's no sun comin' through. So in order to enable each other the two fruits have to look each other in da eye and understand we can only be right, as da ripe is wrong, you know what I mean?"

-HNIC

vivify93

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #118 on: October 22, 2009, 02:56:09 PM »
Actually, W Wind was short for "Whirlwind", not "White Wind".

 :edit:
Also, I agree on all spell changes up till now, and thank you greatly for listening to my opinion.
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darkmage

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Re: FF6 Improvement Project
« Reply #119 on: October 22, 2009, 03:33:01 PM »
Quote from: Poco Loco on October 22, 2009, 02:46:41 PM
I like these man :)

I was thinking, just a small tweak its up 2 u all

x-zone can be changed to void

but hey its just a suggestion :p

Hmm...that's actually not a bad suggestion, Poco. I'll have to think on it.

Quote from: vivify93 on October 22, 2009, 02:56:09 PM
Actually, W Wind was short for "Whirlwind", not "White Wind".

True. But in case it didn't come through, I'm trying to avoid similar-sounding names, and W Wind/White Wind are too close together. I get the idea some would look at that and go "Man, this guy was lazy!"  :wink:
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